Custom irons from Endo, my most expensive golf purchase yet!!

[gocchin]

Okay so I've decided to use part of my Xmas bonus on a new set of irons. Don't get me wrong I love my Tourstage Z101's and I will still keep them as backups as they are one of the best sets of irons ever.

But the time came to buy something new and I figured custom was the way to go. I decided to go with Endo's best forged steel from Epon in the form of the Technity Type X iron. This is going to be my most expensive golf purchase to date and while I'm nervous about it, I didn't want to go halfway and regret it later because I plan on getting these irons to play a very long time. (I have been spending too much lately so this is it) :D

Some specs of the Type X are below from the Epon website. There are several variations of this iron, including with emblem, without, satin, chromed... lots of decisions to make, what do you guys think? :) Oh and of course they will be adjusted loft, length, lie wise for my game.

I've had steel in all my irons except for a set of Tourstage TS-202's that had Matrix MFS 30+ graphite in them. The Epon's are standard with Shimada AC-10 Steel but I've decided to experiment and try some graphite iron shafts from Mamiya Op's Axiv division. I love the Axiv, it's in my driver and I feel it's the best shaft I've ever hit. Many people who have the shaft think the same way. The only thing that scared me is that the Axiv iron shafts are close to $100 EACH retail!!! :eek:

Thank god I have Mamiya connections. Otherwise I'm confident that they will feel great and perform.

Finally I'm going go throw on a set of Iomic Japan minus ion grips. I've narrowed it down to 4 colours. Which ones do you guys like? :)

http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/eponx1.jpg
http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/eponx5.jpg
http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/eponx3.jpg
http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/eponx4.jpg

[Mule56]

Finally I'm going go throw on a set of Iomic Japan minus ion grips. I've narrowed it down to 4 colours. Which ones do you guys like? :)


Gocchin,
Only my opinion, but unless your wife is playing those irons, the only colour is black. :rofl:
Mule

[gocchin]

Gocchin,
Only my opinion, but unless your wife is playing those irons, the only colour is black. :rofl:
Mule

Oh come on Mule. Colours are fun...

Do you think a black grip with a coloured end cap would be okay? :D

[golfinseb]

Those are quite the decorative ferules. Why are there two different irons that are the same model? I like the latter, with the added gold emblem on the lower portion of the clubhead. It seems more decorative than the first club pictured.

As for grips, I agree with Mule, go with black. I could see red but I don't like the two tone colouring with the blue, so black it is.

[gocchin]

Those are quite the decorative ferules. Why are there two different irons that are the same model? I like the latter, with the added gold emblem on the lower portion of the clubhead. It seems more decorative than the first club pictured.

As for grips, I agree with Mule, go with black. I could see red but I don't like the two tone colouring with the blue, so black it is.

Those are the carbon weave ferrules, a standard on the Epon line. I've always liked a clean look but I don't mind the emblem. At least it's not like the gold stuff Honma uses.

Awww you guys don't like the two tone?? The wife has baby blue Iomics with a red cap... I wanted to match. ;)

[dohboy]

I'm with Golfinseb, get the clubs with the gold emblem. Also, get them with the satin finish. IMO, the brushed finish looks too muted and the one without the emblem just looks like something is missing.

In terms of grips, get the baby blue coloured ones with the red cap :cookoo: JUST KIDDING!! Black is the only way to go.

And I'd be happy to take your throw away clubs :p

[Special_K]

Tario,

Those are SICK looking for sure! I like the blue/baby blue cap grip. Crazy ferrules!

Kevin

[TourIQ]

Okay so I've decided to use part of my Xmas bonus on a new set of irons. Don't get me wrong I love my Tourstage Z101's and I will still keep them as backups as they are one of the best sets of irons ever.

But the time came to buy something new and I figured custom was the way to go. I decided to go with Endo's best forged steel from Epon in the form of the Technity Type X iron. This is going to be my most expensive golf purchase to date and while I'm nervous about it, I didn't want to go halfway and regret it later because I plan on getting these irons to play a very long time. (I have been spending too much lately so this is it) :D

Some specs of the Type X are below from the Epon website. There are several variations of this iron, including with emblem, without, satin, chromed... lots of decisions to make, what do you guys think? :) Oh and of course they will be adjusted loft, length, lie wise for my game.

I've had steel in all my irons except for a set of Tourstage TS-202's that had Matrix MFS 30+ graphite in them. The Epon's are standard with Shimada AC-10 Steel but I've decided to experiment and try some graphite iron shafts from Mamiya Op's Axiv division. I love the Axiv, it's in my driver and I feel it's the best shaft I've ever hit. Many people who have the shaft think the same way. The only thing that scared me is that the Axiv iron shafts are close to $100 EACH retail!!! :eek:

Thank god I have Mamiya connections. Otherwise I'm confident that they will feel great and perform.

Finally I'm going go throw on a set of Iomic Japan minus ion grips. I've narrowed it down to 4 colours. Which ones do you guys like? :)
Hi gocchin

WOW what a stunning looking set of heads. I love the discrete look of the very small gold emblem, a distinctive 'touch of class' for an expensive head.

I can't read Japanese from the EPON website, so let me ask this. It says '361' for the Type-X. Is this the material grade? Are the heads stainless or billet forged and chrome plated? I couldn't tell from their posted product info.

If it were me, I would go the following route:
> Satin Chrome [not high lustre polish]
> I hate emblems but LOVE the small gold one on this design of head
> Standard all black 3/4 inch long ferrules for a more traditional look
> The 'black' colored Iomic grips, again more of the traditional look - red cap is ok

What I didn't like are the cheated strong lofts 3-iron to 9-iron [21* to 40* loft respectively]. Getting harder to find, but I want an 8-iron at 40*, with the 9-iron at 44* loft. I want the option and flexibility to add another fairway metal, or an extra hybrid as a long iron replacement. Then I want 3 wedges at 49*, 54*, and 59* loft [ALL constant length to the 9-iron] for the PW, SW, LW respectively. The 49* PW can match the iron set, or it can be of blade design to match the other wedges.

I like the PW to be made to the same length and frequency as the matching 9-iron, except the PW loft is now 49*. Depending on the raw head weight of the PW, it can be made the same or slightly higher swingweight as the 9-iron.

Curious about the business relationship between Endo and Epon, and some related questions:
> does Endo own Epon?
> does Endo make the forged irons for Mizuno and KZG?
> how do you compare forged heads from Endo / Epon vs. Miura [http://www.miuragolf.com/]?

How expensive [Cdn or USD] is this set of irons 3-PW assembled with standard steel shaft?

Your Xmas Gift will be so EXPENSIVE, you will NOT want to hit them :eek:
but enjoy :D [if you can't spoil yourself, its hard to spoil others ...]

[zone555]

I'm leaning towards the blue/red cap and then the red/blue cap grips. Completes the full JDM look. Now all you need is a 1999 Nissan Skyline R34 GT-R to match.. woooh yah! :hyper:

[xander.uk]

i think a black grip with a coloured end cap is a good idea.
If the end cap is black in colour.........lol

nice set of sticks though

[danscustomgolfshop]

That's a nice looking set of irons - with the charcoal grip.
$100 a pop isn't that outrageous for a quality set of forged.
Just be sure that these babies get set-up correctly, cause they won't be any fun if the lie or length is not suited to you and your game.

[gocchin]

That's a nice looking set of irons - with the charcoal grip.
$100 a pop isn't that outrageous for a quality set of forged.
Just be sure that these babies get set-up correctly, cause they won't be any fun if the lie or length is not suited to you and your game.

Hi Dan,

It's $100 A SHAFT.

The irons are considerably more. :)

[Pingnut]

I don't think you'll ever be paired up with someone using the same sticks as yourself.. :p Hope you hit them long and straight!
My 2 cents on the grips would be to go with the blue and get matching end caps. They are going to look sick in your bag.

[gocchin]

Curious about the business relationship between Endo and Epon, and some related questions:
> does Endo own Epon?
> does Endo make the forged irons for Mizuno and KZG?
> how do you compare forged heads from Endo / Epon vs. Miura [http://www.miuragolf.com/]? (http://www.miuragolf.com/%5D?)

How expensive [Cdn or USD] is this set of irons 3-PW assembled with standard steel shaft?

Your Xmas Gift will be so EXPENSIVE, you will NOT want to hit them :eek:
but enjoy :D [if you can't spoil yourself, its hard to spoil others ...]

Hi Harry,

Thanks for the feedback. The strong lofts on irons has always been an issue on JDM sets.

Yes Epon is 100% owned by Endo which is why they get the best steel.

While Endo forges close to 70% of forged irons on the market, they do not do Mizuno. As far as I know Mizuno has their own forgings. I can find out about KZG.

Comparing Endo and Miura is difficult. Both have different grades and quality of forgings but I'd say that best Endo and best Miura are pretty close. Some say that best Endo is the softest there is besides Scratch Golf clubs.

The set above in steel retails for $1398USD, the graphite shafts (8 pieces) for $755USD and the grips are around $100USD. I'm lucky to know enough people to not have to pay retail. :)

I don't think you'll ever be paired up with someone using the same sticks as yourself.. :p Hope you hit them long and straight!

Which is a good thing right? :)

It's one of the reasons why I really want to go all out customizing this set. To be different. Now I need to practice like heck and take a few more lessons to get a game to match the looks of my equipment... :D

[swaaain]

Go with the Superman Red And Blue Grips, I have them on my irons and they look sweet.

[Louie]

Hey guys, this is what i was told by a Mizuno rep is their clubs are made at (not sure on the spelling) Kauffman Forging in the U.S.:) and also speculated that Titleist clubs are done there as well.

[ak108]

What about a downpayment for a new car ? haha kidding.

gocchin, those irons are so beautiful love the little gold epon logo on it. The dark blue or black with red cap iomic looks great. Good luck sir.

[racmbs]

Hi Dan,

It's $100 A SHAFT.

The irons are considerably more. :)

Tario,

There was a guy selling a set of these on TSG for like $900 I think.

Nice set though, gay ferrules though. :p :rofl:

[Mule56]

Go with the Superman Red And Blue Grips, I have them on my irons and they look sweet.

I should have known you'd see Superman in those grips buddy. Now as long as you don't get to close to that Kyrptonite you'll be okay. :rofl:
Mule

[racmbs]

I should have known you'd see Superman in those grips buddy. Now as long as you don't get to close to that Kyrptonite you'll be okay. :rofl:
Mule

Swain owns the pyjama and bed linen set for both Superman and Wonder Woman.

[gocchin]

I'm leaning towards the Red and blue grips especially if they help me strike the ball better... :)

Scott, there was a set of used Epon's on tSG for $900USD but those were Type J's and made for really low handicappers and good ball strikers. I'm not quite at that level yet, but if I were Type J's would be it. Not to worry though, I'm getting a killer deal on the brand new Type X's.

Endo has done forged irons for Titleist and Nike, they still do all of Tourstages irons which alone is 40% of the Japanese market. Japanese forging houses are made up as follows:
Endo which forges 70% of forged heads has it's factories in Thailand (YES Thailand)
Miura is made in Japan & Taiwan
Mizuno forged products are made in Japan
Srixon is made in Japan
Honma Beres is made in Japan

[racmbs]

I'm leaning towards the Red and blue grips especially if they help me strike the ball better... :)

Scott, there was a set of used Epon's on tSG for $900USD but those were Type J's and made for really low handicappers and good ball strikers. I'm not quite at that level yet, but if I were Type J's would be it. Not to worry though, I'm getting a killer deal on the brand new Type X's.

Endo has done forged irons for Titleist and Nike, they still do all of Tourstages irons which alone is 40% of the Japanese market. Japanese forging houses are made up as follows:
Endo which forges 70% of forged heads has it's factories in Thailand (YES Thailand)
Miura is made in Japan & Taiwan
Mizuno forged products are made in Japan
Srixon is made in Japan
Honma Beres is made in Japan

Either way Tario, Epon Endo forgings are the sweetest to look at and I'll be happy to help you get them dirty this spring. :D

As for Titleist, the only irons Endo are forging for them were the 695 MB's and I think the 670's, might be wrong. As for other OEM's they do Srixon as well as Taylor Made (all of their tour stuff is done through Endo now since Miura told 'em to pound sand :rofl:) Mizuno continues to use Miura for tour stuff and from what I remember, pretty sure all of their retail forgings are also Miura.

In the end though, it's so hard to really tell the diff between stuff that's forged in either Thailand, China or Japan.......satin is satin and chrome is chrome. Big advantages to having stuff done through the tour departments is head weights are exacted.

[leftintherough]

Nice looking heads. From the pictures provided, the ones with the emblem look very sharp. For the grips, go with YOUR sense of taste and style. I don't know if I could handle the red ones, but who cares, these will be your p'mping sticks.

[TourIQ]

Hi Harry,
Thanks for the feedback. The strong lofts on irons has always been an issue on JDM sets.
Yes Epon is 100% owned by Endo which is why they get the best steel.
While Endo forges close to 70% of forged irons on the market, they do not do Mizuno. As far as I know Mizuno has their own forgings. I can find out about KZG.
Comparing Endo and Miura is difficult. Both have different grades and quality of forgings but I'd say that best Endo and best Miura are pretty close. Some say that best Endo is the softest there is besides Scratch Golf clubs.
Hi gocchin

> What is JDM?
> Does Mizuno make their own forged irons heads in Japan?
> Forged irons can get too soft. Then they mar up easy and look beat up after a few weeks of play, the score lines began to mark up easy and mushroom together, and the loft and lie angles will not hold their settings. Better is harder forgings that will last longer then add Pro-Soft vibration dampening inserts to the steel shafts, then it feels like a soft forging without the inherient problems associated with the metal grade.
> Let me know who and where they forges the KZG irons [and thanks]

[racmbs]

Hi gocchin

> What is JDM?
> Does Mizuno make their own forged irons heads in Japan?
> Forged irons can get too soft. Then they mar up easy and look beat up after a few weeks of play, the score lines began to mark up easy and mushroom together, and the loft and lie angles will not hold their settings. Better is harder forgings that will last longer then add Pro-Soft vibration dampening inserts to the steel shafts, then it feels like a soft forging without the inherient problems associated with the metal grade.
> Let me know who and where they forges the KZG irons [and thanks]

Hi Harry,

I'll answer for you, considering you didn't READ my post :p :rofl:

> What is JDM? Japanese Something/Something, probably referring to Japanese irons having shorter clubs/stronger lofts :D

> Does Mizuno make their own forged irons heads in Japan? Mizuno is forged by Miura, both tour and retail

> Forged irons can get too soft. Then they mar up easy and look beat up after a few weeks of play, the score lines began to mark up easy and mushroom together, and the loft and lie angles will not hold their settings. Better is harder forgings that will last longer then add Pro-Soft vibration dampening inserts to the steel shafts, then it feels like a soft forging without the inherient problems associated with the metal grade. I'll agree with the marring, but as far as forgings not holding their lie/loft setting, I'd have to disagree. Although one thinks investment casting isn't as soft as forging, when they really are, investment cast irons do not hold their lie/loft settings after long periods of play as do forged irons.

> Let me know who and where they forge the KZG irons: KZG are Endo forged, their premium line being the KZG ZO's...and no, they do not come left handed and never will.

[TourIQ]

Hi Harry,

I'll answer for you, considering you didn't READ my post :p :rofl:

> What is JDM? Japanese Something/Something, probably referring to Japanese irons having shorter clubs/stronger lofts :D

> Does Mizuno make their own forged irons heads in Japan? Mizuno is forged by Miura, both tour and retail

> Forged irons can get too soft. Then they mar up easy and look beat up after a few weeks of play, the score lines began to mark up easy and mushroom together, and the loft and lie angles will not hold their settings. Better is harder forgings that will last longer then add Pro-Soft vibration dampening inserts to the steel shafts, then it feels like a soft forging without the inherient problems associated with the metal grade. I'll agree with the marring, but as far as forgings not holding their lie/loft setting, I'd have to disagree. Although one thinks investment casting isn't as soft as forging, when they really are, investment cast irons do not hold their lie/loft settings after long periods of play as do forged irons.

> Let me know who and where they forge the KZG irons: KZG are Endo forged, their premium line being the KZG ZO's...and no, they do not come left handed and never will.
Hi Scott

Thanks for the input and insight. Actually I got in late tonight from a 7 course meal at the VP's house with wine between each food group. I jumped on and went to the end without seeing your comments, so you are indeed correct.

So I can assume Duane's MP-30's and my MX-23 would be Muira forged?
Does Endo forge all of the KZG forged irons, not just their premium ZO offering. I also have a set of head KZG Original CB's in satin I wanted to build for myself. I can't decide if it will be the KZG or the Mizuno's.

KZG does make at least 2 models in LH forged. A blade offering and a shallow cavity back offering but 'forgedblade' hated the looks of both offering in LH. Not even the same design of head with more offset and not as clean a look.

[xander.uk]

In my defence before i disagree with anybody i want to say that maybe mizuno europe is different to mizuno in the u.s.a/canada region???

but ALL mizuno forged irons and wedges sold in europe are produced at the chuo factory in hiroshima the source of my information?

mizuno!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115

speaking about the loft and lie of your mizuno forgings mizuno say that the loft and lie of their forgings should not alter through normal usage!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=33


now dont all shout at me at once!
write to mizuno or contact them on their website!
or as i said maybe these statements apply only to europe as the information comes from mizuno europe!

[gocchin]

In my defence before i disagree with anybody i want to say that maybe miznuo europe is different to mizuno in the u.s.a/canada region???

but ALL mizuno forged irons and wedges sold in europe are produced at the chuo factory in hiroshima the source of my information?

mizuno!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115

speaking about the loft and lie of your mizuno forgings mizuno say that the loft and lie of their forgings should not alter through normal usage!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=33


now dont all shout at me at once!
write to mizuno or contact them on their website!
or as i said maybe these statements apply only to europe as the information comes from mizuno europe!

You are correct. I mentioned the same thing in a few of my posts on page 1. Mizuno forges their own retail forged irons in Japan. As for tour issues I'm not sure but can easily find out from some Japanese sources but I don't think the are Miura, as I'm not aware of them having any sort of relationship.

And you're right about soft forgings and being bent out of lie. Most companies recommend checking the lie and loft every year, however it's a rare case that any adjustments need to be done. They do ding easily though which is why I use iron headcovers, especially if the set is to be worth over $2000.

JDM = Japanese Domestic Market

and I'll find out about KZG today.

[racmbs]

In my defence before i disagree with anybody i want to say that maybe miznuo europe is different to mizuno in the u.s.a/canada region???

but ALL mizuno forged irons and wedges sold in europe are produced at the chuo factory in hiroshima the source of my information?

mizuno!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115

speaking about the loft and lie of your mizuno forgings mizuno say that the loft and lie of their forgings should not alter through normal usage!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=33


now dont all shout at me at once!
write to mizuno or contact them on their website!
or as i said maybe these statements apply only to europe as the information comes from mizuno europe!

I have no idea what goes on in Europe and whether or not the forging houses used would be different, but my source tells me that for US and Canada, ALL forgings done both tour and retail for Mizuno are through Miura.

Either he's on crack, or it's quite possible that in Europe the forgings might be done at a different plant due to location?

In any case, who really knows these days.....unless ya work for them, it can all be considered pure speculation still. :rofl:

[westbeach]

Facts about Mizuno.....

ALL forged clubs are done in Chuo. How do I know this? Mr Mizuno made a brief visit recently as part of Mizuno's 100th year anniversary campaign and I asked one of his representatives. This information basically validated what one of the most techy Mizuno sales rep told me as well.

As a matter of fact, they even went as far as saying that the other brands use different manufacturers for their tour players whereas with Mizuno, what you bought from retailers are the same as what the pro's play (minus customization of course). They are very proud of this fact.

[hogannut]

If you ever want to sell your Z101's p/m me, they are one sweet club.

[denchoe]

Hey gocchin where did you get that tourstage bag....it's crazy looking...is it leather? And where can i get one:)

[racmbs]

Facts about Mizuno.....

ALL forged clubs are done in Chuo. How do I know this? Mr Mizuno made a brief visit recently as part of Mizuno's 100th year anniversary campaign and I asked one of his representatives. This information basically validated what one of the most techy Mizuno sales rep told me as well.

As a matter of fact, they even went as far as saying that the other brands use different manufacturers for their tour players whereas with Mizuno, what you bought from retailers are the same as what the pro's play (minus customization of course). They are very proud of this fact.

Kewel, so I stand corrected and thank you Ted/xander.uk for the great information. :)

I will now email my buddy in the US and virtually b!tch slap him across the face for the incorrect information and making me look like a tool, although that isn't that hard to do. :rofl:

I fought with him tooth and nail over this and I myself thought they were Endo, he basically told me in a polite way I was wrong/he was right as he was in the biz and I should believe him. In his defense though, this is the first time he's been wrong so I can't get too mad with him.

But my question would be this Ted....HOW long has Mizuno been forging their product in Chuo, to the best of your knowledge? If not since the inception, it's quite possible they did acquire the services of Miura in the past which might be the reason why he was so hard-pressed on drilling it in my head they were forged through and through Miura....both tour and retail.

I always wondered who forged my MP29's.....they were so purrdy to look at and were buttery soft.

Hey gocchin where did you get that tourstage bag....it's crazy looking...is it leather? And where can i get one:)

www.tourspecgolf.com

Get ready to be hosed on shipping, thanks to living in Canada. :D

[gocchin]

If I ever sold the Z-101's, it'd have to be heads only as they are totally fit for me, Nippon shafts 1/2" shorter (yeah
I'm small), lie 2* flat. But right now they are too nice a set to sell (in awesome shape).

@ Denchoe: I got the white Tourstage carry bag from Japan, it's a PVC leather-like type of materia, top notch
workmanship. Tourstage is known to make some of the best bags in Japan... I want to pick up a tour bag now to go
along with it but I can't decide black or white or both... ;).

http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/cbtx70.jpg

[gocchin]

Another note... checking around with Japanese Spec connections. It appears ALL Mizuno forgings are from Chuo in Japan and have been for many years. So what Westbeach is saying is of course right on. There are differences in some of the irons due to their assembling being done in different places.

[westbeach]

But my question would be this Ted....HOW long has Mizuno been forging their product in Chuo, to the best of your knowledge? If not since the inception, it's quite possible they did acquire the services of Miura in the past which might be the reason why he was so hard-pressed on drilling it in my head they were forged through and through Miura....both tour and retail.

I always wondered who forged my MP29's.....they were so purrdy to look at and were buttery soft.


It would've been in the last few years. So, depending on when you talked to your friend, he could've been right but I KNOW for sure that within the past year or two, they forge their own products. ie. there is a Mizuno plant.

[racmbs]

It would've been in the last few years. So, depending on when you talked to your friend, he could've been right but I KNOW for sure that within the past year or two, they forge their own products. ie. there is a Mizuno plant.

I talked with him about this quite a while back Ted, when I was living in Montreal actually which would put this almost 4 years ago....so this would make total sense then. That would mean then that they were most likely forged by Miura at that time, but have since changed to Chou based on your information.

Thanks again for the heads up. :)

[gocchin]

Okay guys, got this totally cleared up. Miura did indeed used to forge Mizuno's irons, however Mizuno decided to move their forging process to a factory that forges exclusively for them in Chuo, Japan. The factory does work 100% for Mizuno but are not a "Mizuno" owned factory per say. And the quote from my post before of "many years at Chuo" is in fact 3-4 years. So that makes both Scott and Westbeach right. :D

[xander.uk]

sorry guys..................

chuo forged nick faldo's irons and have forged for mizuno for more than 20 years!

Mizuno say that Chuo has worked exclusively with them for more than 20 years!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115


again my source is mizuno's own website!

i dont know if there is any confusion in where they are forged and where they are assembled?

mizuno has many worldwide assembly centres and it makes sense that maybe european/asian/american players have slightly different requirements in terms of style and physique? i dont know but for sure chuo has been forging for mizuno more than 20 years!

( thats not to say it has been a mutually exclusive relationship for 20 years and that maybe mizuno didnt try out a few other places? but they are not acknowledged by mizuno at all on their website!)

a search on katsuhiro miura does reveal that retief goosen was (allegedly.lol...so i dont get a writ) using his forgings when supposedly using taylormade golf clubs when he won the U.S open but i cant find any record of him working in or at chuo or of him making a mizuno tour players clubs?

[gocchin]

Yes Mizuno has had Chuo forge their irons for a few decades and the plant in Chuo was dedicated to making only Mizuno irons, however it was not until 3-4 years ago that Mizuno had Chuo do 100% of all their irons.

[racmbs]

sorry guys..................

chuo forged nick faldo's irons and have forged for mizuno for more than 20 years!

Mizuno say that Chuo has worked exclusively with them for more than 20 years!

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115


again my source is mizuno's own website!

i dont know if there is any confusion in where they are forged and where they are assembled?

mizuno has many worldwide assembly centres and it makes sense that maybe european/asian/american players have slightly different requirements in terms of style and physique? i dont know but for sure chuo has been forging for mizuno more than 20 years!

( thats not to say it has been a mutually exclusive relationship for 20 years and that maybe mizuno didnt try out a few other places? but they are not acknowledged by mizuno at all on their website!)

The term "exclusive" in the golf world my friend, is about as solid as my putting from 6' in. :D They may have been working "together" over the past 20 years, but that still wouldn't stop them from obtaining services from a master like Katsuhiro Miura.

I emailed my buddy this morning after this whole debate started, and he stands firm by his comments made to me some 4 years ago....and that he can absolutely without a doubt confirm %100, that Miura did in fact forge Mizuno's products within my lifetime....so that pretty much puts them in the 20 year window. He has access to tour issue equipment and THEN tells me that the MP29's I had some 5 years ago he gave to me, were Tour Issue/Miura forged irons and I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW DAMMIT! :rofl:

And to think I sold them for $600.......:mad:

[gocchin]

Okay guys now that we've determined that Chuo has been working with Mizuno for a long time and in the last 3-4 years does all Mizuno's work, before which Miura played a hand in forging Mizuno, which bag should I get to go with my new irons... ? :D

[xander.uk]

bet you wish you had them now :) ...come to think of it i wish I had them because for $600 you gave them away :$

i agree exclusive is only exclusive when they want it to be..lol

i still say nothing feels like a miura.......i mean mizuno:eek:


THE BLACK BAG..................the white 1 is too white for my taste!


AND WHO IS THAT GORGEOUS GAL IN THE INPAKUTO AD?

[racmbs]

Another note... checking around with Japanese Spec connections. It appears ALL Mizuno forgings are from Chuo in Japan and have been for many years. So what Westbeach is saying is of course right on. There are differences in some of the irons due to their assembling being done in different places.

Hmm, that all depends Tario.

If you are looking for flash/style, then the White bag is a sweet choice.

If you are looking for flash/style and want the bag to hold it's color, then the Black bag is your best choice.

Either way, both of those Tour bags are really flashy and I'd have a hard time picking between the two.

BUT, if you want my choice....I'd say go with the White as it just screams style. :D

[westbeach]

sorry guys..................

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=201

http://golf.mizunoeurope.com/resources/faq.asp?id=115


again my source is mizuno's own website!

i dont know if there is any confusion in where they are forged and where they are assembled?

mizuno has many worldwide assembly centres and it makes sense that maybe european/asian/american players have slightly different requirements in terms of style and physique? i dont know but for sure chuo has been forging for mizuno more than 20 years!

( thats not to say it has been a mutually exclusive relationship for 20 years and that maybe mizuno didnt try out a few other places? but they are not acknowledged by mizuno at all on their website!)


If you look at the second question regarding the MP37, if you look at what products are listed, the MP32 is the newest of the bunch. That iron is about 3 to 4 years old so that tells you the question was most likely asked 2003-2004 range.

Just remember that Mizuno was switched in the last few years. So, even though mizuno stated they were forged in Hiroshima, they are correct b/c of the timeline of the question.

As far as the Chuo 20 year statement goes, it could be true that they worked with Mizuno for that period to "develop" clubs. This doesn't mean they produced it for them en mass.

[gocchin]

Hmm, that all depends Tario.

If you are looking for flash/style, then the White bag is a sweet choice.

If you are looking for flash/style and want the bag to hold it's color, then the Black bag is your best choice.

Either way, both of those Tour bags are really flashy and I'd have a hard time picking between the two.

BUT, if you want my choice....I'd say go with the White as it just screams style. :D

Good call Scott, my Tourstage carry bag is white and it hasn't been too bad at holding it's color (well I baby it to death). And as you said white is very stylish indeed. It's definitely a hard choice but I'm guessing either one will look good as with my setup. Here are some other views of my buddy Chris' bags:

http://member.tourspecgolf.com/gallery/main.php/d/6017-1/DSC_0008.jpg
http://member.tourspecgolf.com/gallery/main.php/d/6020-1/DSC_0114.jpg

[rgk5]

The Chuo factory is correct for Mizuno forgings. The cast clubs are made in China. Verified by our Mizuno rep in October.

[racmbs]

I dunnooooooooooo Tario.....that White bag is lookin' mighty sweet from where I'm sitting.

If you've already got the White carry bag, then compliment your collection by getting the Black Tour bag so that they can all get along together peacefully.

Don't want any of your clubs getting jealous now do we.....:D

[xander.uk]

they are both fine bags but for me the white bag takes your eyes off whats IN the bag.
look at your photo's the black bag says style/class........and your eyes are drawn to your irons!
Then you appreciate the whole package.

to me the white bag says;HEYYYYY OVER HERE! YES OVER HERE! WHITE BAG CLUBS IN THEM LOOK AT ME!! ME!! ME!!

so i wouldnt notice your clubs so much and that would be a shame!

my advice would be to get both the black 1 winter and the white 1 for summer!

[racmbs]

they are both fine bags but for me the white bag takes your eyes off whats IN the bag.
look at your photo's the black bag says style/class........and your eyes are drawn to your irons!
Then you appreciate the whole package.

to me the white bag says;HEYYYYY OVER HERE! YES OVER HERE! WHITE BAG CLUBS IN THEM LOOK AT ME!! ME!! ME!!

so i wouldnt notice your clubs so much and that would be a shame!

my advice would be to get both the black 1 winter and the white 1 for summer!

Ok, yer banned from this thread bro....:D

[Grass Roots Tour]

I think I like the white tour bag better which is rare cause with PING tour bags I didn't like the white ones. The base is unique on these tour bags and look very solid.



While you guys are hashing who forged what.......... Who forged my Nike blades? And are they the same as the tour players' heads?

[fresh]

BUT, if you want my choice....I'd say go with the White as it just screams style. :D

kinda like my ping bag that i got off swaaaaaaaain??? HAHAHA

PIMPIN AINT EASY!!!!!!!!!!

[racmbs]

I think I like the white tour bag better which is rare cause with PING tour bags I didn't like the white ones. The base is unique on these tour bags and look very solid.



While you guys are hashing who forged what.......... Who forged my Nike blades? And are they the same as the tour players' heads?

Endo forged Nike at one point.......they may have changed since as I haven't kept on top of this manufacturer.

[Grass Roots Tour]

So what role does Tom Stites play in the NIKE wheelhouse?

[golfinseb]

So what role does Tom Stites play in the NIKE wheelhouse?

He holds Tigers hand and pats him on back whenever he gets upset :)

[Grass Roots Tour]

He holds Tigers hand and pats him on back whenever he gets upset :)



Ha ha ha. I think Stites is claiming to have designed the Nike blades. What they likely did was copy the mixed Mizuno MP 14 and MP 29 set that TW played in Amateur golf.
I think Endo forged the set but I'm not sure.

[racmbs]

What they likely did was copy the mixed Mizuno MP 14 and MP 29 set that TW played in Amateur golf. I think Endo forged the set but I'm not sure.

I refuse to get into THIS debate...I got slapped around on BSG for making comments and got banned until like 2479. :rofl:

BUT...there's always a butt, I'm a butt man....:D

When he first went to Titleist, his original set of irons were forged after the same mouldings used to design the 14/29 combo set he used throughout his NCAA career. As to whether or not Titleist continued to do that for him, I have no idea but I do remember a rumor going around at one time that the 681T's were moulded/forged against the EXACT specs that he used on Tour.

Rumor has it though that Tiger will be switching to the new Sumo irons that are completely square from front to back.

[ak108]

I love those tourstage bags ! Any idea how much are they ?

If I ever sold the Z-101's, it'd have to be heads only as they are totally fit for me, Nippon shafts 1/2" shorter (yeah
I'm small), lie 2* flat. But right now they are too nice a set to sell (in awesome shape).

@ Denchoe: I got the white Tourstage carry bag from Japan, it's a PVC leather-like type of materia, top notch
workmanship. Tourstage is known to make some of the best bags in Japan... I want to pick up a tour bag now to go
along with it but I can't decide black or white or both... ;).

http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/cbtx70.jpg

[gocchin]

It was just released in December and is currently retailing for around $400 CAD from what I've seen. However shipping on this baby will be the killer!!

[mizuno_mp37]

PLEASE get a plain black ferrule, those carbon weave ferrules detract from the great lines of the head!

[rgk5]

"Rumor has it though that Tiger will be switching to the new Sumo irons that are completely square from front to back."

:rofl: Yes, with "square, boxed" grooves. :eek:

[denchoe]

If I ever sold the Z-101's, it'd have to be heads only as they are totally fit for me, Nippon shafts 1/2" shorter (yeah
I'm small), lie 2* flat. But right now they are too nice a set to sell (in awesome shape).

@ Denchoe: I got the white Tourstage carry bag from Japan, it's a PVC leather-like type of materia, top notch
workmanship. Tourstage is known to make some of the best bags in Japan... I want to pick up a tour bag now to go
along with it but I can't decide black or white or both... ;).



I think you should go with the white...looks like you're the flashy type...I really like that carry bag...are you willing to part with it? ;)

[gocchin]

I think you should go with the white...looks like you're the flashy type...I really like that carry bag...are you willing to part with it? ;)

The bag is still just like new as you can see in the pics I took today below (first three pics)... I may let it go though as I have my eye on a few new bags... :)

http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/tsbagnow.jpg

[gocchin]

To answer the question posted by a few members here...

I finally was able to find out, KZG irons are forged by Kyoei Japan which have factories in Japan and throughout Asia. They are a respected forging house in Japan along the lines of Endo and Miura.

[ak108]

That is a sweeeet bag! If you're ever letting that go... please PM me first!
Anyways are those stand bag strongs ? Are the legs durable ?

The bag is still just like new as you can see in the pics I took today below (first three pics)... I may let it go though as I have my eye on a few new bags... :)

http://www.inpakuto.com/scans/tsbagnow.jpg