Critique My Swing

[SW20 MR2]

So I've been working on my swing a few times a week since I got my dome membership.

Here's a video of my swing. Some of you may have already seen it from my shaft suggestion thread.

Link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4GAIs8pqTE)

The main things that I've been working on are a good takeaway and good tempo. In the past, I had problems in taking my club back both too far outside and inside (one extreme to another). On my downswing, I would swing way too fast. Another common fault of mine is that I don't clear the hips as my arm comes down...at least that's what my instructor tells me. I know my backswing is quite slow and deliberate. Is this a bad thing?

My ball flight used to be straight, but I've been getting a small fade lately. On my misses with the short irons, I tend to pull the ball. With my misses in the long irons, I tend to be a little right. I've never measured my swing speed, but I hit my 7i 150-155 yds (don't remember my 7i loft) and my PW 120-125 yds (46* loft).

Be nice. I know it's not pretty. :D

[GQuizzle]

Doesn't look too bad... your club does have a little "out-to-in" path which would explain your fade and the pull with the short clubs. Going right with the long irons could be from a multitude of things in the swing and/or club - need to see you swing a long iron to say.
A slow, deliberate backswing is fine as long as you are comfortable with it and it works for you.
Not too bad at all...

[hogannut]

Your right foot is "out" to much which causes your right knee to straighten to much. A right knee that is to straight is a major cause of a fade/push/slice. Try turning your right foot "in" a bit so it is closer to a 90deg angle compared to your target line (the club along the ground). You will increase your power and accuracy. The Hogan 5 step book goes into good detail on this subject and has good illustrations to show you. Hogan always felt the "secret" was in keeping the right knee bent.

[itrcb4]

Nice form! Actually your swing looks better than most guys at that dome :rofl:

Not that my swing is any better, but here's my 2 cents based on what I been taught, or from watching the Pros play on TV:

your backswing is a bit slow, but you know it's definitely better than being too fast (my problem...). I suppose as long as you feel the weight transfer to your right side and coil, and your ball striking is consistent and stright.. why not just keep doing what you're doing? It's a nice looking swing as far as I can tell..

If you believe in what this book suggests: Tour Tempo: Golf's Last Secret Finally Revealed, and the 3:1 ratio, you might want to try speeding up your backswing a bit.

The only other thing that I read is to maintain the flex in your right knee. Some folks say if you keep it straight you might turn back too much and lose your pivot.. and in turn lose power.

BTW just curious...

How long have you been playing, and any suggestion for a good instructor?

[SW20 MR2]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll keep an eye on the right knee.

itrcb4,
I've been playing for 4 years. The first 2 years I played sporadically (every 2-3 weeks) while the last 2 I averaged once a week. I finally broke 100 fairly regularly last year. My putting sucks rocks: average almost 40 putts per round. :(

I take lessons from Terry Kim at Angus Glen. He works well for me. He's very patient and works with what you have instead of re-working everything (unless your swing is really bad :D ).

[Carlton]

Looks like a nice smooth swing to me but I'm not pro instructor. Nobody ever hit a ball on a backswing so if a slow backswing gets you swinging on plane, go for it. 46° PW is one strong PW.

My backswing was as long as yours and I know that used to get me into trouble. Near the end of last season, I started working on shortening my backswing trying to keep my waist/hip a bit more quiet. I try and keep my belt buckle steady so that it does not rotate as much away from the target. With the shorter backswing and more torque in the torso area, it feels pretty good. The swingspeed monitor says I'm swinging faster but I feel very much in control of my swing. I'll see when I take this swing outdoors to see what happens after 70yards!

[hogannut]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll keep an eye on the right knee.

itrcb4,
I've been playing for 4 years. The first 2 years I played sporadically (every 2-3 weeks) while the last 2 I averaged once a week. I finally broke 100 fairly regularly last year. My putting sucks rocks: average almost 40 putts per round. :(

I take lessons from Terry Kim at Angus Glen. He works well for me. He's very patient and works with what you have instead of re-working everything (unless your swing is really bad :D ).

if you are truly taking 40 putts per round you should be spending your pracitice time in a ratio of 2:1 for putting against ball striking. So....for every 1 hour you hit balls you should be putting 2 hours. You will NEVER break 100 consistently with 40 putts per round, even if you hit it like Tiger tee to gree. As we all know all pro's hit the ball 300 yards and usually straight. In most cases a players place on the money list is directly related to his putting stats. It may be boring, but putting is the most important aspect of the game. Out of all the clubs used in a round the putter is used the most.

[SW20 MR2]

What would you suggest in terms of practicing putting? I have a mat at home that I use that enables me to practice hitting the ball square. I've made some decent inroads this winter in that respect. However, much of my putting woes relate to reading the green and distance. Both of which are reliant upon actual greens at the various courses. I tend to play many different courses throughout the year, all with vary green undulations and green speeds.

if you are truly taking 40 putts per round you should be spending your pracitice time in a ratio of 2:1 for putting against ball striking. So....for every 1 hour you hit balls you should be putting 2 hours. You will NEVER break 100 consistently with 40 putts per round, even if you hit it like Tiger tee to gree. As we all know all pro's hit the ball 300 yards and usually straight. In most cases a players place on the money list is directly related to his putting stats. It may be boring, but putting is the most important aspect of the game. Out of all the clubs used in a round the putter is used the most.

[GQuizzle]

When I'm practicing my putting, I focus on distance/speed control and reading the line correctly. I don't really care about putting the ball in the cup, but I work on getting the ball close - within a foot or less. This takes the pressure off making the putt and allows me to focus on what I want to practice. Sometimes, I won't even putt towards the hole. Instead I will putt towards the fringe and try to get it as close as I can. Its all distance and speed for me.

[hogannut]

What would you suggest in terms of practicing putting? I have a mat at home that I use that enables me to practice hitting the ball square. I've made some decent inroads this winter in that respect. However, much of my putting woes relate to reading the green and distance. Both of which are reliant upon actual greens at the various courses. I tend to play many different courses throughout the year, all with vary green undulations and green speeds.

I play all over too, so I know what you mean. However if you develop a stroke you have confidence in then it makes the adjustment from course to course much easier. I have certain drills and training aids I use to practice putting. The training aid I have is the "putting arc". Just google "putting arc" and check the site out. I use the putting arc a lot at home during the winter. I will practice 50 putts with just my left hand, then right hand and then both hands.

Some of the putting drills I use on the practice green is the "clock" drill and one I call the "quarter toss drill" The clock drill is what it sounds like. Start at 12 o'clock and putt around the clock at 3-6-9 foot distances. This builds your short-medium distance confidence. This is a great drill and you see a lot of PGA guys doing that drill. A very good drill for warm ups too on a new course to get used to the speed.

The "quarter toss drill" I only do when I;m practicing, not warming up for a game. What you do is take a quarter and toss it a certain distance, whatever distance you want, and then drop a couple of balls and try to putt to the quarter so that your ball rolls over the quarter and goes past no more than a foot. Great drill for building confidence in determining distances. The drill also promotes a fluid putting stroke, which most poor putters don't have. Also I putt a lot with one hand and then the other. You will notice very quickly what hand is your "dominent" hand.

Other than those 2 drills I also will usually have a little competition with myself at the end of my putting practice session. I'll take 2 balls and putt them around the practice green and keep score. Most practice greens should have numbered flags, if not make up your own course. This is a great way to end your practice session as it does a couple of things.

First of all you get to have a little "fun" instead of doing boring drills for an extended period of time. Secondly by having a little competition with yourself, or a buddy if you go with someone it puts you into a "game" situation mentally. Another "pressure" thing I do after my little competition is to do a 3 foot clock drill forcing myself to make each putt and if I miss I have to start over again. This drill can really pi** you off but it pays off on the course.

About 5 years ago now, I was stuck at about a 8 handicap. I hit a lot of range balls, mostly because I enjoy hitting balls, but I was getting frustrated because I put the time in but wasn't getting any better. One night during the winter I was looking over score cards from the previous year and started noticing I was consistently taking anywhere between 32-38 putts per round. For some reason it jumped out at me and I realized I had to cut that number signifigantly to lower my handicap.

The next year I forced myself to hit less balls and practice putting more and as of right now I am a 3 and usually have between 30 - 33 putts per round. Even that many is still to much, but it is better. When i was a kid I was a very good putter, so as my ball striking got better I starting focusing on that more and more as I always felt I was a good putter. It wasn't until I noticed my stats that I came to realize I USED to be a good putter, but no longer was. Now I enjoy putting more and more. Putting is its own game, and is where you win and lose. Nothing can take the wind out of your opponents sails faster than you making a good putt. Golf is funny. A 15 foot put can mean more than a 280 yard drive. Good luck!!!:rolleyes: ;) :D :)

[The Troll]

The training aid I have is the "putting arc".

I'm a big believer in this as well so long as you aren't a straight back and straight thru putter. I luv my putting arc. One of our sponsors sells this:

www.Etailgolf.ca (http://www.etailgolf.ca/)

Was always a lousy putter....38-40 a round was quite common. One day, after many years of frustration, I asked my local pro for a putting lesson. Having seen me putt often he really set about teacing me to roll the ball. To be honest, now that I have an understanding I see that very few amateurs really have good roll on their putts. He was waiting with a putting arc and a lot of patience. Even told me that virtually no one ever asks for a putting lesson.

A week later I had 28 putts at Hamilton G&C which anyone would be thrilled with. For the next year my putting average was just under 30. A little knowledge goes a long way. But no matter how good your technique focus is just as important imo.

I actually ask my pro to teach me very useable shots, such as a low spinning wedge, as opposed to the full swing.

Your swing is not bad better than many for sure. If you want to shorten the swing then try the Path Pro I mentioned in another thread.

[SW20 MR2]

Great, that helps a lot. I'm going to try those drills once the season starts and I can get on some real putting greens. I was planning on focusing much of my lessons this year on short game and putting as opposed to iron striking.

[owenmxz600]

Well you make good contact everytime! If it works who cares what it looks like! ( and Im not saying its bad, Its alot better then mine!:shhh: )

[3whack]

You should be scoring much better than you are with your swing. Sure, there are some issues with it, but there are with just about everyone's

However, given your poor putting and the slightly (I mean very slightly) stiff and overly deliberate nature of your swing, you need to work on the "feel" and "athletic" aspect of the game.

How do you do that? Hate to say that I really don't know---cause I don't---but it does seem to be the thing missing from various aspects of your game.

But, a good pro should be able to help you with that.

[abbeypro]

You do alot of things well in your swing. Your posture looks good and your clubface is square at the top to name a couple.

In my opinion you should never cease to improve, if you wish to achieve your potential in golf. You're swing plane could be improved. It is your hands that get off plane which in turn puts your club off plane going up. If you watch your hands in the early part of your take-a-way, you'll notice they go out or away from your body. This might possibly be due to you trying to correct a 'flat' or inside take-a-way in the past. Rather than pushing the hands out and away, think of getting them in and under the club to support it on the way up. Its challenging to describe this, much easier with a picture. I like to think "hands in, club out" in the early stages of the take-a-way to promote the club going up and avoid a 'flat' upswing.

Hope this helps

[Daws]

You need to work on your ball retrieval from the trough. 2 whiffs can really hurt your confidence.

Seriously, the swing looks good. I'm no teacher, but I know my instructor would tell me to improve my posture. You have a little rounding in your back near the top. If you can keep your back straighter, your shoulder turn becomes much easier to get your shoulder under your chin. This should give you more power and allow you to attack the ball from the inside better. Should also help get rid of the fade.

Was just at the dome tonight... good luck!

-Daws

[SW20 MR2]

Man, you guys rock. I went to the range last night and made a few adjustments based on your suggestions: not flaring my right foot, less rounding of the back at the top, and not pushing my hands out during the takeaway. I was ripping the ball last night. My misses were slight blocks to the right (not too bad), and my fade pretty much disappeared. It was nice having my dead straight ballflight back. I was also hitting the driver and 4i very well, which is normally not the case.

I'm gonna go to the range again later today. Hopefully things will carry forward. :D

[Shadow]

Man, you guys rock. I went to the range last night and made a few adjustments based on your suggestions: not flaring my right foot, less rounding of the back at the top, and not pushing my hands out during the takeaway. I was ripping the ball last night. My misses were slight blocks to the right (not too bad), and my fade pretty much disappeared. It was nice having my dead straight ballflight back. I was also hitting the driver and 4i very well, which is normally not the case.

I'm gonna go to the range again later today. Hopefully things will carry forward. :D On your downswing, when your hands are in the middle of your chest, your club shaft is more vertical than horizontal. Even though you loop your hands a little at the transition from too upright to just right, your hands move out too far as you continue down and this is why you fade the ball, or BLOCK it by hanging on.

Try this simple, simple drill. Place a quarter 12" to the right of the ball and 3" inside the target line. As you swing down imagine the club head passing over the quarter.

Try this first, swinging, just looking at the quarter, replacing the ball with a rubber tee. Second, look at the rubber tee rubber and swing over the quarter seeing it in your peripheral vision. Thirdly, use a ball.

If you can tape a sequence without the ball looking at the quarter, post it for us to see. You should drool at the improvement.

[SW20 MR2]

On your downswing, when your hands are in the middle of your chest, your club shaft is more vertical than horizontal. Even though you loop your hands a little at the transition from too upright to just right, your hands move out too far as you continue down and this is why you fade the ball, or BLOCK it by hanging on.

I don't quite understand. Would you mind explaining further? :)

I'll try the drill next time at the range. Thanks for your help.

[Daws]

I don't quite understand. Would you mind explaining further? :)

I'll try the drill next time at the range. Thanks for your help.

You are casting the head of the golf club a little too far outside (causing your shaft to become quite vertical) on your downswing.

Another tip that helped me on this was to try pointing the butt end of your club towards the ball on your downswing. This is the same principle as those laser training aids that show you a path to trace with the butt end of your club on the downswing. It will keep your swing on plane.

Good luck,
Daws

[GOLFINGGINO]

your posture looks pretty good, the back swing looks to be a bit slow but it appears that you are making good contact with the ball in the 2 swings we can see, you should work on your short irons / wedges, that to me is the best way to reduce your putts, the closer you get to the hole you get the lower the puts you should have, you can easily reduce your score by 5 by hitting these clubs closer, just keep working at it, if you watch the tour pro's some of them dont have perfect swings but they get the job done, just look at rocco mediate - his swing at best looks like a 15 handicaper and look what he shoots, chris

[SW20 MR2]

Okay, so if I'm understanding this correctly and using your drill below, the butt of my club would be pointing well behind the ball instead of right at it?

I always hear golf pros talk about lagging the clubhead to create more power. If the shaft is less vertical, doesn't that mean that I wouldn't have much lag?

Sorry for all the questions. I appreciate everyone's info in helping me to learn and improve.

You are casting the head of the golf club a little too far outside (causing your shaft to become quite vertical) on your downswing.

Another tip that helped me on this was to try pointing the butt end of your club towards the ball on your downswing. This is the same principle as those laser training aids that show you a path to trace with the butt end of your club on the downswing. It will keep your swing on plane.

Good luck,
Daws

[Daws]

Okay, so if I'm understanding this correctly and using your drill below, the butt of my club would be pointing well behind the ball instead of right at it?

I always hear golf pros talk about lagging the clubhead to create more power. If the shaft is less vertical, doesn't that mean that I wouldn't have much lag?

Sorry for all the questions. I appreciate everyone's info in helping me to learn and improve.

Less vertical from the view behind the ball. This has nothing to do with the lag you would see from a face on view. The more lag the better.

Maybe I better stop giving advice since i am by no means a pro and can see how these descriptions can be confusing! :confused:

-Daws

Can't resist...

From behind the ball I'd like to see your shaft more on the plane:
More like this: \ instead of this: | (exaggeration)

From the side view you wouldn't notice much difference, both would ideally have a nice lag...

[TourIQ]

If you average 40 putts / round you probably miss a lot inside 4 to 5 feet as well, even closer. Put a tee in the ground measured 4 feet from a practice cup. Now putt 3 consecutive putts into the 1 cup, pull them put and start over. Keep going until you miss a single putt, and each day see if you can get your consecutive streak to a higher number. Then when you get over a shot putt, you will have all the confidence you need to make a lot of them.

What do you use for a putter? Some guys putt better with a toe heel weighted putter like a Newport, others fancy a mallet like a 2-Ball. Have you been fitted for a putter. Many golfers play with the flat stick too long for them. A change in length, even the grip can give you more control on lag putting.

Just noticed you use a Odyssey White Steel 2-Ball Blade.
Is this putter face balanced or does it have some toe hang like a Newport?

If you putt on an arc, this putter [if face balanced] may be ill-fitted to your stroke.

[SW20 MR2]

Okay, got it. I know exactly what you mean now. :D

What is the general cause of people doing this? That is, am I not pulling my elbow in enough? Not turning my hips early enough? Etc.


From behind the ball I'd like to see your shaft more on the plane:
More like this: \ instead of this: | (exaggeration)

From the side view you wouldn't notice much difference, both would ideally have a nice lag...