Leaf fans

[davevandyk]

I want to ask all the leaf fans how you are feeling for the upcoming year? I saw that Sundin was just signed for 5.5/1 year. Also heard on Prime Time sports that 23 out of 31 of the players that played last year, and signed for this upcoming year.

So how do you feel about the team. Obviously biased, but i don't like the fact that Ferguson is basically going in the same direction as last year, where the leafs missed the playoffs. He just strikes me as a guy that is afraid to be the one to blow the team up, although he knows its not working.

Curious to the leaf fans opinions??

DISCLAIMER: Please don't turn this into a leafs vs Sens thread, although i am a Sens fan, i would much rather see a Canadian team in the playoffs than a Islanders or Lightning team.

[racmbs]

I want to ask all the leaf fans how you are feeling for the upcoming year? I saw that Sundin was just signed for 5.5/1 year. Also heard on Prime Time sports that 23 out of 31 of the players that played last year, and signed for this upcoming year.

So how do you feel about the team. Obviously biased, but i don't like the fact that Ferguson is basically going in the same direction as last year, where the leafs missed the playoffs. He just strikes me as a guy that is afraid to be the one to blow the team up, although he knows its not working.

Curious to the leaf fans opinions??

DISCLAIMER: Please don't turn this into a leafs vs Sens thread, although i am a Sens fan, i would much rather see a Canadian team in the playoffs than a Islanders or Lightning team.

I'll be a happy Leafs fan, when they send McCabe the pylon packing.....

[MikeB]

I want to ask all the leaf fans how you are feeling for the upcoming year? I saw that Sundin was just signed for 5.5/1 year. Also heard on Prime Time sports that 23 out of 31 of the players that played last year, and signed for this upcoming year.

So how do you feel about the team. Obviously biased, but i don't like the fact that Ferguson is basically going in the same direction as last year, where the leafs missed the playoffs. He just strikes me as a guy that is afraid to be the one to blow the team up, although he knows its not working.

Curious to the leaf fans opinions??

DISCLAIMER: Please don't turn this into a leafs vs Sens thread, although i am a Sens fan, i would much rather see a Canadian team in the playoffs than a Islanders or Lightning team.

It all starts from the top and until they sign a first rate GM like the Raptors did with Colangelo they will continue to be a mediocre team. Problem with the Leafs is that mediocrity pays quite handsomely.

[CharlieDog]

The problem with this team is not the people running it! It's the fans that support them! The team has no reason to produce a winner with the place being packed every night and a line up a people as long as the 401 waiting to buy season tickets for the same team that they have been putting on the ice for the past 3-4 years!

I wouldnt be surprised if they come back and sign Peca again this year!

The fans need to take a lesson from the fans in Montreal!

[racmbs]

The problem with this team is not the people running it! It's the fans that support them! The team has no reason to produce a winner with the place being packed every night and a line up a people as long as the 401 waiting to buy season tickets for the same team that they have been putting on the ice for the past 3-4 years!

I wouldnt be surprised if they come back and sign Peca again this year!

The fans need to take a lesson from the fans in Montreal!

How is this the fans fault? Do the fans take to the ice every night and get paid millions to play the sport?

I was a huge Habs fan a while back, until Roy left. But I'm not sure I understand your comment about the fans needing to take a lesson from the fans in Montreal.

Alot of good that did Les Canadiens this past season, they got knocked out of playoff contention by a team that stinks just as equally.

[CharlieDog]

[quote=racmbs]How is this the fans fault? Do the fans take to the ice every night and get paid millions to play the sport?quote]

How is it not! If the fans are willing to overpay time and time again for a team that is just ok, then why would the front office go out of thier way to waste time and effort to put a contender together when they know that thier fans are just going to go to game after game no matter what is in front of them as long as they have a leaf jersey on!

[dks_34]

I don't think this coming season will be any different from previous seasons. Its going to take some break out seasons for a couple of players for the Leafs to get anywhere and if they make the playoffs, they will be finished in the early rounds.

Unfortunately Toronto fans will continue to go to the games and sell out the ACC.

[golfguy25]

[quote=racmbs]How is this the fans fault? Do the fans take to the ice every night and get paid millions to play the sport?

I was a huge Habs fan a while back, until Roy left. But I'm not sure I understand your comment about the fans needing to take a lesson from the fans in Montreal.

Alot of good that did Les Canadiens this past season, they got knocked out of playoff contention by a team that stinks just as equally.[/quote

The fans in Montreal just plain and simple stopped buying tickets when thetr Habs were really struggling a few years back. When the saw that the management team actually wanted a winning team on the ice they started to buy tickets again.

My prediction for next year is that the Leafs only lose 20 games all year and win every series in the Stanley cup playoffs in 4!!!! GO LEAFS GO!!!

[guitarman]

My prediction for next year is that the Leafs only lose 20 games all year and win every series in the Stanley cup playoffs in 4!!!! GO LEAFS GO!!!

Finally you see the light. But you forgot to say "and the SENS don't make the playoffs".

I'll be a happy Leafs fan, when they send McCabe the pylon packing.....

And they can send Kabina with him.

[swingpure]

This is next year. That is the year we win the CUP! GO LEAFS GO!!!!!

[Pingnut]

The leafs have been signing "fan favorites" for more money than they are worth for a long time. I don't see any real effort being put into building a hockey team that can compete.

[laxgolf]

I'll be a happy Leafs fan, when they send McCabe the pylon packing.....

You sir are about to get your wish....along with another nice surprise. :shhh:

[racmbs]

You sir are about to get your wish....along with another nice surprise. :shhh:

And just where are you getting your information from.

Please do tell, I'm about to organize the bon-voyage party for him. :D

[davevandyk]

Finally you see the light. But you forgot to say "and the SENS don't make the playoffs".

thought we wanted to keep this thread on what you think of the leafs ;)

[laxgolf]

And just where are you getting your information from.

Please do tell, I'm about to organize the bon-voyage party for him. :D

You'll see. ;)

Sworn to secrecy.

[guitarman]

thought we wanted to keep this thread on what you think of the leafs ;)

Sorry. Got carried away.

[avidgolfer]

The Leafs need a Colangelo make-over like what the Raptors got last year. Not too long ago, the experts were saying that the Raptors will take 3 years to flush all the bad contracts like Jalen Rose, Eric Williams, Hoffa, whatever that stiff's name was... All those characters are gone and replaced with better players.

McCabe gotta go... Kubina gotta go... Gill gotta go... O'Neil See Ya! Sundin... mixed emotions...

A GM will make mistakes. But even Rob Babcock got rid of Rafer Alston for a useful guard in Mike James. I know the NHL has a more draconian cap system but... If JFJ is a real GM, he should find a way to fix his mistakes.

[guitarman]

And just where are you getting your information from.

Please do tell, I'm about to organize the bon-voyage party for him. :D

See this link. Scroll down a bit. Its about all I could find.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/rumors

[landlord]

Imlach and Cliff Fletcher are the only Leaf GMs I can think of who had a clue.

[Bellyhungry]

It is not the common fan's fault as much as it is more the fault of the 'Corporate fan-base'. As long as comporations keep buying corporate boxes and fuel the MLSE with $, the MLSE is more than happy to maintain the status quo and occasional make some cosmetic trades and signings to appease the common fans. The Sundin signing falls right into that category - Next season, he will play 60-70 games, score some goals; Leafs missing the playoffs. Same old crap, different year.

BTW, there are more non-Canadians on the Leafs than the Sens...If you love Canada, go cheer for the Sens.

[davevandyk]

It is not the common fan's fault as much as it is more the fault of the 'Corporate fan-base'. As long as comporations keep buying corporate boxes and fuel the MLSE with $, the MLSE is more than happy to maintain the status quo and occasional make some cosmetic trades and signings to appease the common fans. The Sundin signing falls right into that category - Next season, he will play 60-70 games, score some goals; Leafs missing the playoffs. Same old crap, different year.

BTW, there are more non-Canadians on the Leafs than the Sens...If you love Canada, go cheer for the Sens.

the fault is solely the management, not any fans or corporate fans! The leafs are not the only sports franchise that sells out everynight.

[avidgolfer]

My BIGGEST beef to that arguement that MLSE only cares about money not winning is that most of the winning teams in the past few years have had smaller payrolls than the Leafs!

Also if MLSE REALLY cared about saving money or getting the most bang for their $$$$'s, they should install good management for the Leafs (like the Raptors) who can either win more games with the current budget or win the same number of games with less money. The way current management is operating the team now by blowing the payroll on stiffs is counter-productive to the goal of maximizing the returns received by the shareholders.

[guitarman]

My BIGGEST beef to that arguement that MLSE only cares about money not winning is that most of the winning teams in the past few years have had smaller payrolls than the Leafs!

.

You definitely have something there. Since the end of the Ballard years it doesn't seem like the Leafs have been stingy on spending money.

[davevandyk]

What i don't understand is that if Sundin is "committed" to getting the leafs all the way, why didn't he pull a Selanne/Kariya?? Sign for $1million and let them use the other 4.5million to sign a guy that can actually support him? Its not like he doesn't have enough money in the bank. I am not saying he SHOULD have done this, but why not?

I am not gonna say whether he is worth 5.5/year, just saying that he could have sacrificed the money and perhaps they could have gotten Drury/Briere or even more importantly, a guy like Nabokov which they badly need a goalie, AND Mats for the 5.5million!

Not a move that most players would do, so i understand why he didn't, but for a guy that badly wants to bring the cup to Toronto, why not?

[avidgolfer]

:eek: What i don't understand is that if Sundin is "committed" to getting the leafs all the way, why didn't he pull a Selanne/Kariya?? Sign for $1million and let them use the other 4.5million to sign a guy that can actually support him? Its not like he doesn't have enough money in the bank. I am not saying he SHOULD have done this, but why not? Perhaps they could have gotten Drury and Mats for 6.0million instead of just Mats for 5.5million!

I am not gonna say whether he is worth 5.5/year, just saying that he could have sacrificed the money and perhaps they could have gotten Drury/Briere or even more importantly, a guy like Nabokov which they badly need a goalie

The answer is obvious. If Sundin signed for 1.0MM, MLSE will just issue a 4.5MM dividend to the Teachers Pension Plan... :eek:

[SoNgMaN]

sorry to slash all the hopes of trading pylon mccabe but does he not have a no trade clause in his contract?

[avidgolfer]

sorry to slash all the hopes of trading pylon mccabe but does he not have a no trade clause in his contract?

He does but... the "source" of the rumour says that he may be willing to waive it for a trade to the Islanders. Let's just hope...

[hogannut]

I want to ask all the leaf fans how you are feeling for the upcoming year? I saw that Sundin was just signed for 5.5/1 year. Also heard on Prime Time sports that 23 out of 31 of the players that played last year, and signed for this upcoming year.

So how do you feel about the team. Obviously biased, but i don't like the fact that Ferguson is basically going in the same direction as last year, where the leafs missed the playoffs. He just strikes me as a guy that is afraid to be the one to blow the team up, although he knows its not working.

Curious to the leaf fans opinions??

DISCLAIMER: Please don't turn this into a leafs vs Sens thread, although i am a Sens fan, i would much rather see a Canadian team in the playoffs than a Islanders or Lightning team.

As much as I was very excited about last year with getting a quality coach here and tried to defend JFJ for getting Maurice here, the Leafs are going nowhere. The Marlies have a bunch of 3rd and 4th liners, which we already have, so nothing there to get excited about other than Poggie.

Ironically the best aspect of drafting and development for MLSE is defence and what does JFJ do??? Loads up on useless defencemen like Kubina and Gil, which do nothing other than chew up salary caps and take up spots for these young defence. Last year it should have been Mc Cabe and Kaberle as the top 2 and the rest of the defence core SHOULD have been the top 4-5 Marlies. If Ian White didn't stand on his head he would have wasted another year in the AHL last year.

So JFJ is trying to develop players but continues to use up the spots on the NHL team for more over paid, under achieving players? Isn't this counter productive? I am a Leaf fan, but next year will be a repeat of this year. A .500 team at best that will struggle to get 8th place. JFJ does not have the business savy to land a big name player for Sundin, and if Mats was smart he'll waive his no trade and go to a conteneder in the spring in 2008.

THe rest of the team is 3rd and 4th line players for any decent team in the NHL. This is getting back into the Ballard era again. IT will be ugly at best next year for them. Until such time that the $ stops flowing to MLSE regardless of what kind of product they are putting out this conversation will continue year after year.

Other than that I think the Leafs have a good chance!!:rofl: :eek: :hush:

[MP33]

It's too hard to predict with the parity in the NHL these days. Look at Edmonton and Carolina this year. Cup finalist from a year ago and both miss the playoffs. I know Edmonton lost Pronger but they weren't even close to making the playoffs. Look at Tampa and Calgary. Finalists from two years ago and both just squeezed into the playoffs (1 point by Calgary and 2 by Tampa). This despite Vinny Lecavailer having a career year and the resurgence of Martin St. Louis. If you look at this past year, I don't think anyone could say that the 6th, 7th and 8th seeds in the East were "head and shoulders" above the 9th to 11th seeds. It came down to the last weekend of the season on who made the playoffs and it was just a matter of who got hot at the right time. I suspect it will be like this again next year.

[hogannut]

It's too hard to predict with the parity in the NHL these days. Look at Edmonton and Carolina this year. Cup finalist from a year ago and both miss the playoffs. I know Edmonton lost Pronger but they weren't even close to making the playoffs. Look at Tampa and Calgary. Finalists from two years ago and both just squeezed into the playoffs (1 point by Calgary and 2 by Tampa). This despite Vinny Lecavailer having a career year and the resurgence of Martin St. Louis. If you look at this past year, I don't think anyone could say that the 6th, 7th and 8th seeds in the East were "head and shoulders" above the 9th to 11th seeds. It came down to the last weekend of the season on who made the playoffs and it was just a matter of who got hot at the right time. I suspect it will be like this again next year.

I agree with you, but what I would like to see is a team that ISN'T fighting for 6th to 11th, but is in a Buffalo/Ottawa category. This is what the Leafs SHOULD be year in and year out. They sell all their tickets, have the most loyal (or stupid) fans in all of hockey, and arguably all of sports, in a hockey crazy part of the world and what do us Leaf fans talk about? We talk about the CHANCE of them making the playoffs!!! We should be talking about their CHANCE of winning the cup year in and year out.

THere is absolutely no reason or excuse that TOronto shouldn't have expacatations like they do in Detroit, and Jersey and (lately) even Ottawa. THis is what the Leafs should be doing every year, instead of what has been happening for 4 decades!!!!

[davevandyk]

It's too hard to predict with the parity in the NHL these days. Look at Edmonton and Carolina this year. Cup finalist from a year ago and both miss the playoffs. I know Edmonton lost Pronger but they weren't even close to making the playoffs. Look at Tampa and Calgary. Finalists from two years ago and both just squeezed into the playoffs (1 point by Calgary and 2 by Tampa). This despite Vinny Lecavailer having a career year and the resurgence of Martin St. Louis. If you look at this past year, I don't think anyone could say that the 6th, 7th and 8th seeds in the East were "head and shoulders" above the 9th to 11th seeds. It came down to the last weekend of the season on who made the playoffs and it was just a matter of who got hot at the right time. I suspect it will be like this again next year.

I agree that there is parity between the 6th to 12th teams in the east. But you can't compare the leafs to Calgary, Edmonton, Tampa and Carolina. All 4 of these teams have things that toronto does not have, a solid base. All of them have good/great goalies, and have the forwards that could light the lamps... a lot.

As of this time, the leafs don't have a solid goalie, or a forward line-up that is solid. toronto was 6th worst in the league in goals against/game, i would hope fergy is gonna try and address this.

[the_har]

GO OILERS GO

[leftintherough]

My prediction for next year is that the Leafs only lose 20 games all year and win every series in the Stanley cup playoffs in 4!!!! GO LEAFS GO!!!

Wow, this is such a clever post that everyone missed it.

Kudos there big fellow! I for one got the pun :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

It is not the common fan's fault as much as it is more the fault of the 'Corporate fan-base'. As long as comporations keep buying corporate boxes and fuel the MLSE with $, the MLSE is more than happy to maintain the status quo and occasional make some cosmetic trades and signings to appease the common fans. The Sundin signing falls right into that category - Next season, he will play 60-70 games, score some goals; Leafs missing the playoffs. Same old crap, different year.

BTW, there are more non-Canadians on the Leafs than the Sens...If you love Canada, go cheer for the Sens.

Bingo!

You are sooooo correct!

[ryguy]

its awful neither Darcy Tucker or Sundin or Mccabe for that matter shouldve been resigned in the last year or two. We need to bring in neqw fresh talent and use our seasoned veterans as trade bait. I also dont think that Ferguson shouldve received an extension last year. The leafs need to do what the raptors did with colangelo.

[pdonnelly]

It is not the common fan's fault as much as it is more the fault of the 'Corporate fan-base'. As long as comporations keep buying corporate boxes and fuel the MLSE with $, the MLSE is more than happy to maintain the status quo and occasional make some cosmetic trades and signings to appease the common fans. The Sundin signing falls right into that category - Next season, he will play 60-70 games, score some goals; Leafs missing the playoffs. Same old crap, different year.

BTW, there are more non-Canadians on the Leafs than the Sens...If you love Canada, go cheer for the Sens.

Not true, there are 20 Canadian players on the leafs, don't let the last names fool you, they may sound European but some are actually Canadian. I thought there were more Canadian playwers but some are from the U.S.A. Click on the stats for each player to see where they are from.:)

http://www.mapleleafs.com/team/playerstats.asp

Whoops, only 19 on the Leafs are from Canada
http://www.mapleleafs.com/team/index.html

And here are you Sens.

http://www2.ottawasenators.com/eng/team/redirect.cfm?sectionID=hockey/hockeyRoster.cfm

[MP33]

I agree that there is parity between the 6th to 12th teams in the east. But you can't compare the leafs to Calgary, Edmonton, Tampa and Carolina. All 4 of these teams have things that toronto does not have, a solid base. All of them have good/great goalies, and have the forwards that could light the lamps... a lot.

As of this time, the leafs don't have a solid goalie, or a forward line-up that is solid. toronto was 6th worst in the league in goals against/game, i would hope fergy is gonna try and address this.

Edmonton has a solid forward line up? Their leading scorer was a minus 20 and is no spring chicken. Regardless, none of this matters unless you win. Look at SJ this year. All that talent up front, great goaltending and what....not much to show for it when the playoffs came around.

I agree with you, but what I would like to see is a team that ISN'T fighting for 6th to 11th, but is in a Buffalo/Ottawa category. This is what the Leafs SHOULD be year in and year out. They sell all their tickets, have the most loyal (or stupid) fans in all of hockey, and arguably all of sports, in a hockey crazy part of the world and what do us Leaf fans talk about? We talk about the CHANCE of them making the playoffs!!! We should be talking about their CHANCE of winning the cup year in and year out.

THere is absolutely no reason or excuse that TOronto shouldn't have expacatations like they do in Detroit, and Jersey and (lately) even Ottawa. THis is what the Leafs should be doing every year, instead of what has been happening for 4 decades!!!!

That would be nice but I remember in 01 when the Leafs were third (or forth) overall in the reg. season. Still no cup. The way I see it, if you qualify for the playoffs and your team suddenly gets hot at that time, you have a shot.

[davevandyk]

Edmonton has a solid forward line up? Their leading scorer was a minus 20 and is no spring chicken. Regardless, none of this matters unless you win. Look at SJ this year. All that talent up front, great goaltending and what....not much to show for it when the playoffs came around.

I meant they had a solid forward line-up when they made their playoff run. They had 4 guys with at least 60 points, and 10 guys with at least 20 points. Last year the leafs had only 1 guy with at least 50 points, although they did have 12 guys with at least 20 points, so they did have a lot of guys with points. I hear ya about the SJ team this year, but it seems the majority of leaf fans just want to make the playoffs. You are right about if you make the playoffs, almost any of the 16 teams can get hot.

[hogannut]

its awful neither Darcy Tucker or Sundin or Mccabe for that matter shouldve been resigned in the last year or two. We need to bring in neqw fresh talent and use our seasoned veterans as trade bait. I also dont think that Ferguson shouldve received an extension last year. The leafs need to do what the raptors did with colangelo.

Not to slam you on your particular thread, but if you're going to make that statement you should ALSO have a plan about who you are going to try to bring in to fill those spots. So you don't sign Sundin.....who's the captain? You don't sign Tucker....who's your tough guy, who can actually play and log minutes? You have to have an IDEA of who and/or what they are going to do if they don't sign those guys. It's easy to be an armchair GM when you don't have to fill the roster.

As I have already said....IMO.....Ferguson has really confused me by making these statements that they want to get more from drafting and developing, and what do they do last year? They sign 4 defence to big $ long term contracts, meanwhile they actually have quality defence in the Marlies who won't be able to develop because their NHL spot is taken up by Kubina who earned about a million bucks a goal last year!!! You take a look at Woznewski, Kromwall, Coliacovo, White (who ONLY stayed in the NHL lineup because he was SO outstanding) those guys should have been given the 4 spots after Mc Cabe and Kaberle, IF the Leafs were TRULY rebuiding.

The Marlies have maybe 1 or 2 forwar prospects and they still need another year or 2 in the AHL. What I would have done last year is taken my best 9-10 Marlies, that Maurice knew VERY well being the Marlies coach the year before, and had a REAL rebuilding year to see what kind of talent had been developing in the minors.

No franchise kids in the Marlies, and aging veterans, shaky goal tending (poggie is still another year away from being a BACKUP...athough he developed quite nicely last year) and average at best defence, means not only another brutal year in 07-08, but also ZERO to look forward to.

Keep buying those $500 platinum seats you biz-exec's that you write off anyway and could care less about how much it costs, and we will continue the tradition of fighting for the last playoff spot year after year after year after year after year!!!!!!!:(

[laxgolf]

Keep buying those $500 platinum seats you biz-exec's that you write off anyway and could care less about how much it costs, and we will continue the tradition of fighting for the last playoff spot year after year after year after year after year!!!!!!!:(

Funny you mention that on the day Hamilton is taking depositis on season tickets. What kind of pressure will MLSE feel if the Preds invade their market, and are a contender? How do fans feel about the prospect of the Leafs potentially being the 3rd best team in Ontario?

[hogannut]

Funny you mention that on the day Hamilton is taking depositis on season tickets. What kind of pressure will MLSE feel if the Preds invade their market, and are a contender? How do fans feel about the prospect of the Leafs potentially being the 3rd best team in Ontario?


IMO.....Nashville will NEVER end up in Hamilton, the NHL won't let the deal through. Betman has already said so. Also, you can't move a western team to the east and have an uneven number of teams in each confrence. They would have a better chance moving it to Kansas City than Hamilton, Kitchener whereve. Although it makes sense to us southern ONtario hockey fans, the move would further alienate the game from the southern States and Betman in all his "wisdom" continues to think hockey will take off in the south. Hockey has been and will always be a regional interest only in the south, and if the particular team is crap the team will die. It has happened numerous times in the past 30 years, and will continue to happen.

A team as good as Nashville and they can't fill the seats? What part of hockey doesn't work in the south do you NOT understand Gary?:confused:

[davevandyk]

IMO.....Nashville will NEVER end up in Hamilton, the NHL won't let the deal through. Betman has already said so. Also, you can't move a western team to the east and have an uneven number of teams in each confrence. They would have a better chance moving it to Kansas City than Hamilton, Kitchener whereve. Although it makes sense to us southern ONtario hockey fans, the move would further alienate the game from the southern States and Betman in all his "wisdom" continues to think hockey will take off in the south. Hockey has been and will always be a regional interest only in the south, and if the particular team is crap the team will die. It has happened numerous times in the past 30 years, and will continue to happen.

A team as good as Nashville and they can't fill the seats? What part of hockey doesn't work in the south do you NOT understand Gary?:confused:

I think Bettman will get a lot of heat from the owners to allow this deal to go through. I mean Nashville is one of the teams that is getting money from the pool, instead of putting money into it. Hamilton would be able to support the team, and not take money from the revenue sharing. Bettman just has to cut his loses and realize that its just not working in the south, even when the team is good, the fans just don't support the team. I mean how popular would the Lightning be in say Hamilton or Winnipeg... i mean they have Vinny, St. Louis and Richards, Canadian fans would love a team like that to get to see 41 times.

As far as conference placing, i would move Tampa and Florida to the West, and move Detroit and "Hamilton" to the East. Would bring a little better parity between the conferences as well.

[laxgolf]

IMO.....Nashville will NEVER end up in Hamilton, the NHL won't let the deal through. Betman has already said so. Also, you can't move a western team to the east and have an uneven number of teams in each confrence. They would have a better chance moving it to Kansas City than Hamilton, Kitchener whereve. Although it makes sense to us southern ONtario hockey fans, the move would further alienate the game from the southern States and Betman in all his "wisdom" continues to think hockey will take off in the south. Hockey has been and will always be a regional interest only in the south, and if the particular team is crap the team will die. It has happened numerous times in the past 30 years, and will continue to happen.

A team as good as Nashville and they can't fill the seats? What part of hockey doesn't work in the south do you NOT understand Gary?:confused:

Balsille paid enough to do whatever he wants to do with the team. The Board of Governors might not like the way he's done things so far, but the fact of the matter is that the price he paid increases the value of every single team in the NHL. It also gives Bettman a mulligan on what really should have happened back in the eraly 90's. I'm ecstatic that my hometown of Ottawa got an NHL team, but Hamilton should have been awarded a team instead of Ottawa.

Personally, I think it would be great to have a 3rd team in Ontario and I think they should continue to play in the the Western Conference. It's a great opportunity to expose the entire NHL to it's largest and most passionate market. Also, eastern Canada would get a chance to see the western Canadian teams in their own back yard.

[AnnikaFan]

if they move it to hamilton...i hope they reorganize all the conference/divisions..

detroit have no business being in the west....way too much travelling for them.

and try and keep each division to similar time zones..

northwest division you got pacific/mountain/central time zone teams..and that's way too much travelling and time difference, especially since you play each team in the division 8 times..

but of course...the eastern bias could care less.....since their eastern teams don't have to travel nearly as much and don't suffer time zone differences...

[Big Shooter]

Whoa, waaaaaay too much typing/thinking about a sport that doesn't resume for another 3-4 months. Give it a rest, play MORE GOLF!!! :confused: :D

[guitarman]

IMO.....Nashville will NEVER end up in Hamilton, the NHL won't let the deal through. Betman has already said so. Also, you can't move a western team to the east and have an uneven number of teams in each confrence. They would have a better chance moving it to Kansas City than Hamilton, Kitchener whereve. Although it makes sense to us southern ONtario hockey fans, the move would further alienate the game from the southern States and Betman in all his "wisdom" continues to think hockey will take off in the south. Hockey has been and will always be a regional interest only in the south, and if the particular team is crap the team will die. It has happened numerous times in the past 30 years, and will continue to happen.

A team as good as Nashville and they can't fill the seats? What part of hockey doesn't work in the south do you NOT understand Gary?:confused:

Basille way outbid Kansas. How then, can Bettman say no to Basille and award it to Kansas? Bettman gets to tell Leopold how much money he can get for his team?

[leftintherough]

A team as good as Nashville and they can't fill the seats? What part of hockey doesn't work in the south do you NOT understand Gary?:confused:

I travel to Nashville quite a bit for work. In the winter I try to be there on night when the preds are playing. It blows my mind walking up to the ticket window on game night and getting amazing seats for $50 usd. You can also find room in lots or restaurants just across from the Gaylord center. I'll miss that if they move. But...... I love the idea of them going to Hamilton. Should make the leafs step up and be more competative for the long run.

[guitarman]

I travel to Nashville quite a bit for work. In the winter I try to be there on night when the preds are playing. It blows my mind walking up to the ticket window on game night and getting amazing seats for $50 usd. You can also find room in lots or restaurants just across from the Gaylord center. I'll miss that if they move. But...... I love the idea of them going to Hamilton. Should make the leafs step up and be more competative for the long run.

I can't see this going down. I don't think that Basille will buy the Preds (No its not a done deal) if he isn't allowed to move them. He's got a lease to get out of, Betteman has to let him move them and he'll have a big fight with the Leafs and Sabres to be in Hamilton. I can't see it all coming together. Wishful thinking.

[leftintherough]

Funny you mention that on the day Hamilton is taking depositis on season tickets. What kind of pressure will MLSE feel if the Preds invade their market, and are a contender? How do fans feel about the prospect of the Leafs potentially being the 3rd best team in Ontario?

Thanks for putting the leafs ahead of the AHL and Jr A teams.....

I can't see this going down. I don't think that Basille will buy the Preds (No its not a done deal) if he isn't allowed to move them. He's got a lease to get out of, Betteman has to let him move them and he'll have a big fight with the Leafs and Sabres to be in Hamilton. I can't see it all coming together. Wishful thinking.

I believe there's an exit clause in the lease if the attendence doesn't hit a certain target. Word from my nashville friends is that the target was not met ddespite all the good hockey going on down there. Its funny to watch a game there. When the whistle is blown, they annouce why play was stopped. i.e. icing the puck, then they play the rule on the overhead.

To move to Hamilton, they just have to pay enough $$$ to Buff and Tor. for them to sign off on the deal.

[davevandyk]

Thanks for putting the leafs ahead of the AHL and Jr A teams.....



I believe there's an exit clause in the lease if the attendence doesn't hit a certain target. Word from my nashville friends is that the target was not met ddespite all the good hockey going on down there. Its funny to watch a game there. When the whistle is blown, they annouce why play was stopped. i.e. icing the puck, then they play the rule on the overhead.

To move to Hamilton, they just have to pay enough $$$ to Buff and Tor. for them to sign off on the deal.

ya the target is averaging 14,000. Last year including the playoffs in the average, they had 13815.

[GK88]

I think the next few years will be pivotal ones for the Leafs. If they don't put a winner on the ice, it'll have a negative affect upon fan loyalty with future and present generations. I don't think the fan support ( outside of the corporate base) is as strong as MLSE thinks it is. NHL TV ratings highlight this. People under 40 have never seen a winning Leaf team. Apathy is starting to set in amongst many Leaf fans.

[Golfing in Ottawa]

I think the next few years will be pivotal ones for the Leafs. If they don't put a winner on the ice, it'll have a negative affect upon fan loyalty with future and present generations. I don't think the fan support ( outside of the corporate base) is as strong as MLSE thinks it is. NHL TV ratings highlight this. People under 40 have never seen a winning Leaf team. Apathy is starting to set in amongst many Leaf fans.

Leafs will always have a strong following. There are enough Leaf Nation members living here in Ottawa and many of these are kids who were born after 1992 when the Sens were re-born. Heck just go into any sports store across Canada and you will find plenty of Leaf clothing.

I am sure there will be a "big ceremony" in 2047 celebrating the 80 year anniversary of the last Stanley Cup Leafs win. Hope to be still around to see it................:rofl:

[Jeffc]

good article on the leafs ownership woe's...

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Toronto/2007/06/19/4272726-sun.html

[Golfing in Ottawa]

good article on the leafs ownership woe's...

http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Hockey/NHL/Toronto/2007/06/19/4272726-sun.html

Every Leaf fan should read this article and I mean EVERY !!!!

It will show them truly where the priority is.........the BOTTOM LINE !!!!;)

[fresh]

steve simmons credibility was lost earlier this year when he claimed sundin would be out the year with the hip injury and was then proven false.

i take everything he says with a grain of salt

[pdonnelly]

Leafs will always have a strong following. There are enough Leaf Nation members living here in Ottawa and many of these are kids who were born after 1992 when the Sens were re-born. Heck just go into any sports store across Canada and you will find plenty of Leaf clothing.

I am sure there will be a "big ceremony" in 2047 celebrating the 80 year anniversary of the last Stanley Cup Leafs win. Hope to be still around to see it................:rofl:

Least they have one to celebrate :D , unless of course you consider the Sens before they lost their tour card, then 2047 will be the 120th anniversary for the Sens. Here's a little tid-bit...
"The original Ottawa Senators"
Founded in 1893 and folded in 1934, these Ottawa Senators (or the Silver Seven) claimed 9 Stanley Cups and haven't won jack **** since 1927. One of these wins provided the weirdest piece of hockey history when one player kicked Lord Stanley's Cup into a canal while under the influence of crystal meth. He obtained this while using a time machine under the influence of bootlegged whiskey (some claim it was rum).

Now Wikipedia says the Sensitives (much like their fans) have won ten cups, who knows.

[AnnikaFan]

you guys want Cujo back?

hahaha

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/article.jsp?content=20070620_083807_4320

[el tigre]

It has been rumoured that the Leafs are talking to John Muckler about being their senior "hockey" guy (i.e., Ferguson's new boss). They went after Scotty Bowman and he turned them down, and now that Muckler is available...

[SoNgMaN]

you guys want Cujo back?

hahaha

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/article.jsp?content=20070620_083807_4320

sounds as good as who TSN thinks they'll draft

Dreger Says:
The Leafs will show interest in moving up, but don't have a lot to offer in a trade. The Toronto scouts may want Kevin Shattenkirk, but I think GM John Ferguson Jr. is going to play the veto card and add depth up front with Backlund. He's a bit of a gamble because of a bad knee, but he's got moxie.

Another reason JFJ is a complete an utterly useless tool

[the_har]

go oilers go
:D :D :D :D

[golf101]

LEAFS RULE!!!!!!!

Haha. Could do without hockey for a couple years. Just not what it used to be.

[the_har]

LEAFS RULE!!!!!!!

Haha. Could do without hockey for a couple years. Just not what it used to be.



GO OILERS GO !!!!!!

[Golfing in Ottawa]

Least they have one to celebrate :D , unless of course you consider the Sens before they lost their tour card, then 2047 will be the 120th anniversary for the Sens. Here's a little tid-bit...
"The original Ottawa Senators"
Founded in 1893 and folded in 1934, these Ottawa Senators (or the Silver Seven) claimed 9 Stanley Cups and haven't won jack **** since 1927. One of these wins provided the weirdest piece of hockey history when one player kicked Lord Stanley's Cup into a canal while under the influence of crystal meth. He obtained this while using a time machine under the influence of bootlegged whiskey (some claim it was rum).

Now Wikipedia says the Sensitives (much like their fans) have won ten cups, who knows.

Yeah, I guess Eastern Conference Champs is jack ******:rolleyes:

Lets see.... Modern day Sens 1992 - 2007. Thats 13 seasons and (1) Eastern Conference Championship.

Toronto Maple Leafs since 1967 Stanley Cup win. Thats 40 seasons and a BIG ZERO (0) Conference Championships.

Hope you are at least 45 years old so that you can still enjoy the memories of the last big win. If not then ask Mom and Dad..... or if you are one of the youngsters on the forum you may have to ask Grandpa and Grandma.......:D

[golf101]

GO BOILERS GO !!!!!!

:cool:

[pdonnelly]

Yeah, I guess Eastern Conference Champs is jack ******:rolleyes:

Lets see.... Modern day Sens 1992 - 2007. Thats 13 seasons and (1) Eastern Conference Championship.

Toronto Maple Leafs since 1967 Stanley Cup win. Thats 40 seasons and a BIG ZERO (0) Conference Championships.

Hope you are at least 45 years old so that you can still enjoy the memories of the last big win. If not then ask Mom and Dad..... or if you are one of the youngsters on the forum you may have to ask Grandpa and Grandma.......:D
...........:rolleyes: um does that make me look as smart as you?
Yes it is ******, just like anything the leafs have done since 67, conference titles or not. My cousin Keon was on that team ( though I'm about as close to him as I am to Paris Hilton ) and yes I'm over 45, ( why, did you want to date? I hear Ottawa is very multi-cultural and open minded. But no I'm a strict hetero, so what you do in Kanata can stay in Kanata) doesnt matter the leafs last was 67 cause the sens don't have one period since then, chew on that. Next year'll be no different, (now you can jump in and bet me your first born or something equally silly) , 80 years and a big fat zero, I won't use the capital letters, dont' think yelling on a computer does much so drift there you sensitive fan you:rofl: Have a nice summer:)

Flame away I'm off this topic till next year, the Leafs year, at last. Ho ho ho

[AnnikaFan]

GO COILERS GO !!!!!!

:cool::cool:

:cool:
:p ...

[Golfing in Ottawa]

Yes it is *****, just like anything the leafs have done since 67, conference titles or not.

Glad that you admit to the 40 years of jack****;)

[the_har]

GO OILERS GO !!!!!

[Golfing in Ottawa]

GO OILERS GO !!!!!

LEAFS RULE!!!!!!!



:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?service=page&page=StandingsPage&type=CON

[AnnikaFan]

Cole and Neale demoted!!!!! Hughson and Millen promoted!!! No more mispronounced names, or names called on the wrong player etc!!

and best yet--- HNIC will increase national exposure to other Canadian teams and not only concentrate on the leafs!!

ie/ if cal/van play and leafs/some weak team play at the same time...or sens/pits and leafs/some weak team, then HNIC will give priority to the habs/sens or sens/pits!!!

and hughson and millen will take the more attractive games...not just leafs games all the time!!


woohoo~ first step to take Toronto away from the centre of universe mentality......and first step to decrease the hatred on the laffs

http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070621.wspttruth21/GSStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home

LEAFS RULE!!!!!!!



:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


http://www.nhl.com/nhl/app?service=page&page=StandingsPage&type=CON

CANUCKS TRUMPS BOTH!!!

refer to that same link :P

[laxgolf]

Cole and Neale demoted!!!!! Hughson and Millen promoted!!! No more mispronounced names, or names called on the wrong player etc!!

and best yet--- HNIC will increase national exposure to other Canadian teams and not only concentrate on the leafs!!

ie/ if cal/van play and leafs/some weak team play at the same time...or sens/pits and leafs/some weak team, then HNIC will give priority to the habs/sens or sens/pits!!!

and hughson and millen will take the more attractive games...not just leafs games all the time!!


woohoo~ first step to take Toronto away from the centre of universe mentality......and first step to decrease the hatred on the laffs

http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070621.wspttruth21/GSStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home



CANUCKS TRUMPS BOTH!!!

refer to that same link :P


The article says that Cole and Neal won't be getting the better games. In other words, they'll still be broadcasting the majority of the Leafs games on saturday nights, except for when a Canadian team, Buffalo or the Pens are the opponent.

[AnnikaFan]

The article says that Cole and Neal won't be getting the better games. In other words, they'll still be broadcasting the majority of the Leafs games on saturday nights, except for when a Canadian team, Buffalo or the Pens are the opponent.

i could care less if they broadcast most of the leafs games..unless it's a high profile game, in which case, they won't be on the mike anyways.

as long as they STAY THE HECK away from the Canucks games (mainly Leafs vs Canucks...though they are not playing next season)..

their broadcast of nucks vs leafs last season was horrendous...learn the names gosh darn it (Bieksa!!! not Bieska!..and it's luongo, not luluongo or luango)!! and stop turning all the nucks players into leafs players (ie/ Sundin twins...Mats Naslund)

besides, jim hughson is awesome...it'll be refreshing to hear him calling other canadian teams too......tho i'm iffy with millen

hopefully this change means that we won't be seeing leafs on every single HNIC....and means that canadian teams will get equal saturday scheduled games instead of the old ways of where leafs get to play every saturday.

[davevandyk]

so what do leaf fans think, Toskala and Mark Bell to Toronto... 1st, 2nd and 4th round picks of toronto to San Jose? Seems like a high price to pay for a guy that hasn't started more than 36 games/year, although he does look good

[the_har]

so what do leaf fans think, Toskala and Mark Bell to Toronto... 1st, 2nd and 4th round picks of toronto to San Jose? Seems like a high price to pay for a guy that hasn't started more than 36 games/year, although he does look good

HOW ABOUT EM OILERS !!!!!!!!


GO OILERS GO !!!!!!!!!!!

[AnnikaFan]

i like toskala...

it'll be interesting to see how this pans out..

toskala is a good goalie...

but now it looks liek you have 2 backup goalies..

bell is iffy..2mil for 26 pts or osmething..but he's young

[51Phantom]

Toskala will be the #1 Goalie. This is a great grab for the leafs. And I couldn't care less about hockey at this point in my life. But it is a good move.

[AnnikaFan]

damn..you guys could have cheraponov or esposito...

better hope toskala/bell work out.....or else this will be a disaster for the leafs

HOW ABOUT EM OILERS !!!!!!!!


GO OILERS GO !!!!!!!!!!!
great drafting they did today!

sam gagne...nice

[hannah]

[quote=racmbs]How is this the fans fault? Do the fans take to the ice every night and get paid millions to play the sport?quote]

How is it not! If the fans are willing to overpay time and time again for a team that is just ok, then why would the front office go out of thier way to waste time and effort to put a contender together when they know that thier fans are just going to go to game after game no matter what is in front of them as long as they have a leaf jersey on!

Have to agree with you you here, toronto has always been a hockey town and if the leafs were winning or losing the fans will pay whatever it takes to go to the games, I'm a Sudbury Boy and my Short lived career with the Wolves people would always be in the stands, winning or losing, mind you a little difference in what a ticket cost but never less a hockey town will always over pay to watch there team, if the leafs were to bring the cup home I wonder just how many of our diehard season ticket holder's would be buying or could afford to buy there season ticket's and be in the stands. It might not make sense but most season ticket holder's have tickets because the leafs are where they are at the end of the year, can you imagine what a night out would be if they would bring the cup home!!. It might go from $200 plus, that's $20 each for a beer and dog, parking ete, to what, $300 plus for the night, hard to afford to take my daughter to game, have a decent seat, a bite and to park as it is!!.

[MP33]

Cole and Neale demoted!!!!! Hughson and Millen promoted!!! No more mispronounced names, or names called on the wrong player etc!!

and best yet--- HNIC will increase national exposure to other Canadian teams and not only concentrate on the leafs!!

ie/ if cal/van play and leafs/some weak team play at the same time...or sens/pits and leafs/some weak team, then HNIC will give priority to the habs/sens or sens/pits!!!

and hughson and millen will take the more attractive games...not just leafs games all the time!!


woohoo~ first step to take Toronto away from the centre of universe mentality......and first step to decrease the hatred on the laffs

http://www.globesports.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070621.wspttruth21/GSStory/GlobeSportsHockey/home



CANUCKS TRUMPS BOTH!!!

refer to that same link :P


Why someone would post stuff about the Vancouver Canucks on a board based out of Southern Ontario (with most of the posters from Ontario) in the middle of June is beyond me. :confused:

[AnnikaFan]

half the stuff IS about the LEAFS..i was talking about how the LEAFS will not be on every single HNIC...i was talking about how the LEAFS homers Cole and Neale got demoted...i was talking about how all the LEAFS games will not be the automatic #1 game on HNIC.

the only NON-LEAFS talk was a reply to the guy who seem to only talk about the OILERS...and the guy who replied to him using a link of the standings...i only copied their style and tell them to refer to that same link....why you didn't talk to the_har also is beyond me....it's not like I came into the board, this thread, to ONLY talk about the Canucks.


i at least talked about the toskala trade and how you guys could have gotten either an esposito or a cheraponov


I lived in Toronto from 02 to 06..and I started to post on this board when i was living in Toronto..I already established solid ground on this board when I left TO...so I decided to stay here (plus there is no VGN)...i was NOT A LEAFS fan when I was in Toronto......ps. not all Ontario posters are LEAFS fans.....ie/ Sens fans, Golfbum..

but i guess if being a non-ontario person is not welcomed.....or being a non-leafs fan.....or talking about hockey during one of the more exciting days in the offseason (draft and leading up to July 1) is frowned upon..

then I will leave.

[hannah]

half the stuff IS about the LEAFS..i was talking about how the LEAFS will not be on every single HNIC...i was talking about how the LEAFS homers Cole and Neale got demoted...i was talking about how all the LEAFS games will not be the automatic #1 game on HNIC.

the only NON-LEAFS talk was a reply to the guy who seem to only talk about the OILERS...and the guy who replied to him using a link of the standings...i only copied their style and tell them to refer to that same link....why you didn't talk to the_har also is beyond me....it's not like I came into the board, this thread, to ONLY talk about the Canucks.


i at least talked about the toskala trade and how you guys could have gotten either an esposito or a cheraponov


I lived in Toronto from 02 to 06..and I started to post on this board when i was living in Toronto..I already established solid ground on this board when I left TO...so I decided to stay here (plus there is no VGN)...i was NOT A LEAFS fan when I was in Toronto......ps. not all Ontario posters are LEAFS fans.....ie/ Sens fans, Golfbum..

but i guess if being a non-ontario person is not welcomed.....or being a non-leafs fan.....or talking about hockey during one of the more exciting days in the offseason (draft and leading up to July 1) is frowned upon..

then I will leave.

My goodness, are you looking for a hanky to wipe the tears because some guys don't agree with you, I didn't know one had to have permission to post there comments here!, what does it matter if you are from Ont. or fron Van. or your talking about hockey during the off season, I don't get the comment about " I established solid ground on this board so I decided to stay here" I didn't know one had to earn there way on to the forum or do they, if so to bad, we comment, we talk, we discuss and if no-one likes what you say or your input,or disagrees TOO BAD!! Arial Narrow]just listen to what everyone has to say, everyone has good comments and have value to them, if you don't like people's view's don't post, God knows I most likely said things people don't like or agree with, OH WELL!!!.[/B]

[MP33]

half the stuff IS about the LEAFS..i was talking about how the LEAFS will not be on every single HNIC...i was talking about how the LEAFS homers Cole and Neale got demoted...i was talking about how all the LEAFS games will not be the automatic #1 game on HNIC.

the only NON-LEAFS talk was a reply to the guy who seem to only talk about the OILERS...and the guy who replied to him using a link of the standings...i only copied their style and tell them to refer to that same link....why you didn't talk to the_har also is beyond me....it's not like I came into the board, this thread, to ONLY talk about the Canucks.


i at least talked about the toskala trade and how you guys could have gotten either an esposito or a cheraponov


I lived in Toronto from 02 to 06..and I started to post on this board when i was living in Toronto..I already established solid ground on this board when I left TO...so I decided to stay here (plus there is no VGN)...i was NOT A LEAFS fan when I was in Toronto......ps. not all Ontario posters are LEAFS fans.....ie/ Sens fans, Golfbum..

but i guess if being a non-ontario person is not welcomed.....or being a non-leafs fan.....or talking about hockey during one of the more exciting days in the offseason (draft and leading up to July 1) is frowned upon..

then I will leave.

It amazes me why the self proclaimed "non-leaf fans" on this board follow every step of this team even in June. "How will Toskala do this year" or "They would have been better off with Esposito". I see great similarities with the Leafs and Howard Stern. People who love HS listen to his show all the time because they enjoy listening to him. People who say they hate HS can't stop listening so they can criticize what he will say next. The net result is that everyone listens. Maybe another reason why the Leafs continue to have such strong following everywhere in Canada.

[Big Shooter]

damn..you guys could have cheraponov or esposito...

better hope toskala/bell work out.....or else this will be a disaster for the leafs

Mark Bell will be as good or better than D'arcy Tucker or Mike Peca!
...and thank God they went for Toskala over Cujo!!:)

p.s., if Harry Neale is such a "pro-Leaf", is it 'cause his time with The Canucks ended poorly!? :confused:

[hannah]

It amazes me why the self proclaimed "non-leaf fans" on this board follow every step of this team even in June. "How will Toskala do this year" or "They would have been better off with Esposito". I see great similarities with the Leafs and Howard Stern. People who love HS listen to his show all the time because they enjoy listening to him. People who say they hate HS can't stop listening so they can criticize what he will say next. The net result is that everyone listens. Maybe another reason why the Leafs continue to have such strong following everywhere in Canada.

Isn't that so true!!.

[MP33]

Isn't that so true!!.

It's kinda amusing reading some of these threads througout the hockey season. All these threads about how brutal the CBC are at showing only Leaf games. Yet, the same posters will give a detailed synopsis of each and every Leaf game commenting how Tucker was crap on this play or how Raycroft should have made the save on that goal. On one side, these posters complain why other games aren't shown and on the other side, they're the ones watching all the Leaf games. :rofl:

[swingpure]

I'm glad that they almost always show the Leaf's game on Saturday nights, it's my chance to see them, as many of their games are blacked out during the week if there is a Western team playing at the same time.

I could always get the Leafs channel I guess, but I'm not sure what there coverage is like.

swingpure

[el tigre]

Why someone would post stuff about the Vancouver Canucks on a board based out of Southern Ontario (with most of the posters from Ontario) in the middle of June is beyond me. :confused:We have free speech here. We welcome members from all over the world and they are allowed to talk about whatever they want.

If you don't want to read someone's else's comments, then it is up to YOU to ignore it.

[MP33]

We have free speech here. We welcome members from all over the world and they are allowed to talk about whatever they want.

If you don't want to read someone's else's comments, then it is up to YOU to ignore it.

I couldn't agree more. This is why I expressed my OPINION on why someone would talk about the Canucks on a site based out of Toronto in the middle of June.

Can't recall saying that people outside of Toronto are not welcomed on the site. If you read that, than that's fine by me. :rofl:

[Golfing in Ottawa]

I couldn't agree more. This is why I expressed my OPINION on why someone would talk about the Canucks on a site based out of Toronto in the middle of June.

Can't recall saying that people outside of Toronto are not welcomed on the site. If you read that, than that's fine by me. :rofl:

I also can not agree more.............

Being from Ontario, I think we should discuss endlessly the Leafs chances of making the playoffs next season..............and the Sens chances of winning the Cup................:D

[the_har]

I THINK YOU GUYS ALL NEED TO LIGHTEN UP.

ISN'T ONE OF THE BEST PARTS ABOUT BEING A SPORTS FAN IS THE RIBBING THAT IS GIVEN AND RECEIVED WHEN IT COMES TO TEAM LOYALTIES??

[Golfbum]

half the stuff IS about the LEAFS..i was talking about how the LEAFS will not be on every single HNIC...i was talking about how the LEAFS homers Cole and Neale got demoted...i was talking about how all the LEAFS games will not be the automatic #1 game on HNIC.

the only NON-LEAFS talk was a reply to the guy who seem to only talk about the OILERS...and the guy who replied to him using a link of the standings...i only copied their style and tell them to refer to that same link....why you didn't talk to the_har also is beyond me....it's not like I came into the board, this thread, to ONLY talk about the Canucks.


i at least talked about the toskala trade and how you guys could have gotten either an esposito or a cheraponov


I lived in Toronto from 02 to 06..and I started to post on this board when i was living in Toronto..I already established solid ground on this board when I left TO...so I decided to stay here (plus there is no VGN)...i was NOT A LEAFS fan when I was in Toronto......ps. not all Ontario posters are LEAFS fans.....ie/ Sens fans, Golfbum..

but i guess if being a non-ontario person is not welcomed.....or being a non-leafs fan.....or talking about hockey during one of the more exciting days in the offseason (draft and leading up to July 1) is frowned upon..

then I will leave.

Nooooooooooooooooo,don't leave! As the sole supporter of the SHARKS I need someone else from the Western Conference to back me up. (Leafs Fans, you know about the Western Conference don't you? That is where the STANLEY CUP IS RESIDING NOW)

HEY LEAFS FANS LIGHTEN UP. You are getting yourselves wound up about your team and it is not even JULY! :rofl: You'll have plenty of time to do that once the season starts!

Yes this is the TORONTO GOLF NUTS but as stated above not everyone who is a member here is a LEAFS Fan. Nor should they have to be.

[MP33]

Nooooooooooooooooo,don't leave! As the sole supporter of the SHARKS I need someone else from the Western Conference to back me up. (Leafs Fans, you know about the Western Conference don't you? That is where the STANLEY CUP IS RESIDING NOW)

HEY LEAFS FANS LIGHTEN UP. You are getting yourselves wound up about your team and it is not even JULY! :rofl: You'll have plenty of time to do that once the season starts!

Yes this is the TORONTO GOLF NUTS but as stated above not everyone who is a member here is a LEAFS Fan. Nor should they have to be.

Wasn't it a self proclaimed non-Leaf fan that got wound up over nothing??

[the_har]

I think we need to concentrate on the one thing that we all have in common and are passionate about-----

GOLF

[wayland]

Myself being a Leaf fan, I must say that I would suggest banning any further topic/thread/discussion on the Leafs. If you made a top 3 list of worst, damaging threads this site has had in the past 12 months. I would reckon that 2 Leaf threads would make that list easily.

I gave up even reading them because it was so childish and the arguments being ballyed around were all suppositions that can't be proven. [I'm only in here to figure out why we're losing a valued member of the site]

It is a bit rediculous to think that it's the middle of golf season and you guys are still carrying on this topic. I can see when it's dead of winter and we're unable to golf, this board becomes a bit low on traffic so such topics are understandable. It's July for christs sake, go out and hit some balls. Screw hockey. If you are such a diehard hockeyfan, goto a hockey site.

[guitarman]

Myself being a Leaf fan, I must say that I would suggest banning any further topic/thread/discussion on the Leafs. If you made a top 3 list of worst, damaging threads this site has had in the past 12 months. I would reckon that 2 Leaf threads would make that list easily.

I gave up even reading them because it was so childish and the arguments being ballyed around were all suppositions that can't be proven. [I'm only in here to figure out why we're losing a valued member of the site]

It is a bit rediculous to think that it's the middle of golf season and you guys are still carrying on this topic. I can see when it's dead of winter and we're unable to golf, this board becomes a bit low on traffic so such topics are understandable. It's July for christs sake, go out and hit some balls. Screw hockey. If you are such a diehard hockeyfan, goto a hockey site.

I agree. We whine about how we long for golf all winter and nows are chance. HOCKEY IS OVER.
That being said I hope the departing memeber is not leaving over this. Suck it up. I still get ribbed to my face about pi$$ in the fairway.

[Golfbum]

I agree. We whine about how we long for golf all winter and nows are chance. HOCKEY IS OVER.
That being said I hope the departing memeber is not leaving over this. Suck it up. I still get ribbed to my face about pi$$ in the fairway.

I usually golf longer than the Leafs play hockey :D Hockey isn't over, they just held the draft. That is something to talk about isn't it?
And it is ok to take a whiz in the trees :rofl:

[guitarman]

I usually golf longer than the Leafs play hockey

And the Leafs usually golf longer than most teams play hockey.:rofl:

[Ems]

That being said I hope the departing memeber is not leaving over this. Suck it up. I still get ribbed to my face about pi$$ in the fairway.

Well, she did list out other reasons for leaving (not as relevant for her in vancouver) so it wasn't only because of this thread though I'm still somewhat devasted to hear she's left!!

some of these posts definitely cross the line from playful ribbing to just plain rude. I'm not a hardcore hockey fan so don't know how far these posts normally go so I just ignore them until I heard AF left!

my bf's a hardcore leafs fan and I always hear him poking fun at ottawa fans but he never reaches the point where he's rude and insulting. thank god, i won't be able to stand him otherwise.

[Golfing in Ottawa]

Myself being a Leaf fan, I must say that I would suggest banning any further topic/thread/discussion on the Leafs. If you made a top 3 list of worst, damaging threads this site has had in the past 12 months. I would reckon that 2 Leaf threads would make that list easily.

I gave up even reading them because it was so childish and the arguments being ballyed around were all suppositions that can't be proven. [I'm only in here to figure out why we're losing a valued member of the site]

It is a bit rediculous to think that it's the middle of golf season and you guys are still carrying on this topic. I can see when it's dead of winter and we're unable to golf, this board becomes a bit low on traffic so such topics are understandable. It's July for christs sake, go out and hit some balls. Screw hockey. If you are such a diehard hockeyfan, goto a hockey site.

I am very certain you would not have an issue with the discussion if the Leafs had been in the Stanley Cup final.............;)...............oh my mistake if they had been in the Playoffs...............:rofl:

[wayland]

I am very certain you would not have an issue with the discussion if the Leafs had been in the Stanley Cup final.............;)...............oh my mistake if they had been in the Playoffs...............:rofl:

I'd be cheering them on but I wouldn't be acting like an adolescent.

BTW, how do you Ottawa fans feel about the shakeup in Sen's head office?

[laxgolf]

I'd be cheering them on but I wouldn't be acting like an adolescent.

BTW, how do you Ottawa fans feel about the shakeup in Sen's head office?

Yeah that playoff comment was uncalled for and basically proved your point.

I like the shakeup. It was time given that Muckler's about 156 years old. The finals showed that the Sens had some obvious issues and over the years Muckler never seemed to want to address them. Murray will. He's been the architect of a few Cup Final teams that started with basically nothing. In Ottawa he starts with the best team in the East, so all he needs to do is a few tweaks here and there. I'm excited about the direction the team is headed in.

Also, kudos to the Leafs for picking up Toskala and Bell. Yeah they paid a steep price, but they got great value back. Bell will surprise alot of people. I've been watching him since he played for the 67's. He's a tough, physical winger and will be a fan favourite in Leafs land. It wouldn't surprise me a bit to see him play with Sundin. I would have loved to see him in Ottawa, which should have happened last year in the Havlat trade (which brings us back to Muckler not getting the necessary pieces). The Leafs have a couple of pretty big moves to make still, but the battle of Ontario will heat up again next season.

[Jeffc]

It will be interesting to see how this develops, seeing as Toronto traded away their 1st round pick, which could have gotten them either Cherapanov or Esposito. If either of those turns into a star in a few years, it could be another bad decision by the Leaf front office.

[laxgolf]

It will be interesting to see how this develops, seeing as Toronto traded away their 1st round pick, which could have gotten them either Cherapanov or Esposito. If either of those turns into a star in a few years, it could be another bad decision by the Leaf front office.

True, but no one really expected those two guys to be available anyways. There will be other teams than just the Leafs who will regret not taking Cherapanov when they had the chance.

[hogannut]

Who cares......the Leafs will suck next year, and every year after that as long as they are owned by the teachers union. We are right back in the Ballard era again. As much as I like Paul Maurice, this team is going nowhere fast and will continue their losing ways until new ownership takes over, or they stop selling out every game for the most expensive ticket in the league for one of the worst teams.

As a die hard Leaf fan this is hard to write and it really pi**es me off that an organization as succesful as the Leafs were until 1967 has gone down the road they have for the last 40 years.

I am seriously thinking of getting an NHL package this year so I can watch quality hockey instead of another season of trying to get the 8th spot so they can get their minimum amount of playoff games so the teachers union can make yet more money.

I'm done with this garbage team and garbage organization!!!!!!!!!!

[davevandyk]

Who cares......the Leafs will suck next year, and every year after that as long as they are owned by the teachers union. We are right back in the Ballard era again. As much as I like Paul Maurice, this team is going nowhere fast and will continue their losing ways until new ownership takes over, or they stop selling out every game for the most expensive ticket in the league for one of the worst teams.

As a die hard Leaf fan this is hard to write and it really pi**es me off that an organization as succesful as the Leafs were until 1967 has gone down the road they have for the last 40 years.

I am seriously thinking of getting an NHL package this year so I can watch quality hockey instead of another season of trying to get the 8th spot so they can get their minimum amount of playoff games so the teachers union can make yet more money.

I'm done with this garbage team and garbage organization!!!!!!!!!!

welcome to the light :). May i suggest..... GO SENS GO!! ;)

[hogannut]

Well I don't know if I could do THAT, but I will pick a team to follow. I'm thinking Pittsburg will be a good team to watch this year, and the Rangers could surprise a lot of people. In the west I like Detroit, even though they need more Canadians on the team, and am thinking Chicago could be an interesting team to follow next year.

[laxgolf]

Well I don't know if I could do THAT, but I will pick a team to follow. I'm thinking Pittsburg will be a good team to watch this year, and the Rangers could surprise a lot of people. In the west I like Detroit, even though they need more Canadians on the team, and am thinking Chicago could be an interesting team to follow next year.

If Nashville moved to the Hammer, would you support them? Given the proximity, I'd have a hard time not supporting them.

[hogannut]

If Nashville moved to the Hammer, would you support them? Given the proximity, I'd have a hard time not supporting them.

Ya....I would support them, but until it actually happens I'm not even thinking about it. IMO....as I have said this will not happen. First and foremost there would be an uneven amount of teams in the 2 confrences. Betman wants teams in the States, not in southern Ontario regardless of how succesful the franchise would be.:confused:

I will probably continue to watch the Leafs because that's who they show on TV, but I will not be revolving my life around a Leafs game. I will go to movies, go to other hockey in GTA, and support the kids in their hockey.

I feel particularily bad for Paul Maurice who will bust his *** trying to make 3rd rate NHL players comptetitive, but with how improved the east will be this year with Pittsburg and even Philly will be a better team in 07-08, Rangers and even Montreal along with the Ottawa's and Buffalo's it is quite conceivable that the Leafs may finish 16th in the east.....Ok 15th only because of how bad Florida will be.:hush: :help: :shhh:

[Big Shooter]

Here's a Sneak-peak at The Leafs new defensive strategy... :D

[Ace TT]

Oh gawd...here we go..:rolleyes:

why can't everyone just cheer for their respective team and be done with it...why do fans seem to feel the need trash on others because the other team isn't doing so well as yours.

yea so the leafs haven't won jack in forever..but you know what? Leaf fans aren't fans because their team has the most cups, or as people would like to say "most RECENT cups" or how many points they have at the end of every season, or if they even make the playoffs...

the blue and white maple leaf is no longer a logo...it's a symbol...it symbolizes the fans when they were just "x" yrs old sitting in front of a tv with their grandfather watching hnic. it symbolizes your first maple leaf hockey jersey your father gave to u to wear on the pond while u scooted around with ur friends. it symbolizes no matter what you're doing on a saturday night, you sit down with friends, family, whatever...and for 3+ hours, you forget whatever it is that's going on in your life...and just have a great time watching hockey, and cheering for the leafs.....

So say what you will, post funny pictures, and say how much the leafs suck and will never win a cup...

But to me, no matter what you say or do...you'll never take away what the leafs truely mean to me and why
I AM A TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS FAN...

[Golfbum]

Oh gawd...here we go..:rolleyes:

why can't everyone just cheer for their respective team and be done with it...why do fans seem to feel the need trash on others because the other team isn't doing so well as yours.

yea so the leafs haven't won jack in forever..but you know what? Leaf fans aren't fans because their team has the most cups, or as people would like to say "most RECENT cups" or how many points they have at the end of every season, or if they even make the playoffs...

the blue and white maple leaf is no longer a logo...it's a symbol...it symbolizes the fans when they were just "x" yrs old sitting in front of a tv with their grandfather watching hnic. it symbolizes your first maple leaf hockey jersey your father gave to u to wear on the pond while u scooted around with ur friends. it symbolizes no matter what you're doing on a saturday night, you sit down with friends, family, whatever...and for 3+ hours, you forget whatever it is that's going on in your life...and just have a great time watching hockey, and cheering for the leafs.....

So say what you will, post funny pictures, and say how much the leafs suck and will never win a cup...

But to me, no matter what you say or do...you'll never take away what the leafs truely mean to me and why
I AM A TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS FAN...


FUNNY THING IS, THE GUY WHO PUT THAT PHOTO THERE, IS A BIG LEAFS FAN TOO :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[golfguy25]

Oh gawd...here we go..:rolleyes:

why can't everyone just cheer for their respective team and be done with it...why do fans seem to feel the need trash on others because the other team isn't doing so well as yours.

yea so the leafs haven't won jack in forever..but you know what? Leaf fans aren't fans because their team has the most cups, or as people would like to say "most RECENT cups" or how many points they have at the end of every season, or if they even make the playoffs...

the blue and white maple leaf is no longer a logo...it's a symbol...it symbolizes the fans when they were just "x" yrs old sitting in front of a tv with their grandfather watching hnic. it symbolizes your first maple leaf hockey jersey your father gave to u to wear on the pond while u scooted around with ur friends. it symbolizes no matter what you're doing on a saturday night, you sit down with friends, family, whatever...and for 3+ hours, you forget whatever it is that's going on in your life...and just have a great time watching hockey, and cheering for the leafs.....

So say what you will, post funny pictures, and say how much the leafs suck and will never win a cup...

But to me, no matter what you say or do...you'll never take away what the leafs truely mean to me and why
I AM A TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS FAN...


...blah....blah....blah!!!!

[hogannut]

...blah....blah....blah!!!!

A month to training camp and look who shows up!!:eek:

GG25....what's happening big guy? Coming to Copetown this weekend? You will be glad to know I'm not supporting the Leafs anymore, at least until they right the ship, which won't happen until they get rid of the teachers union.

Anyway, I will probably watch the Leafs, as I don't have any NHL packages, but I cancelled Leafs TV and won't renew just so I can watch 15 road games against teams that suck as much as the Leafs!:eek:

I'm not jumping on the Sens band wagon though. In fact I think both Ottawa and Buffalo will struggle this upcoming year, compared to last, and Pittsburg will be strong, Rangers will be in there too, and don't be surprised in Philly gets one of the bottom playoff spots and makes some noise in the first couple of rounds.

[racmbs]

I'm done watching hockey....I've now switched to curling.

[davevandyk]

I'm not jumping on the Sens band wagon though. In fact I think both Ottawa and Buffalo will struggle this upcoming year, compared to last, and Pittsburg will be strong, Rangers will be in there too, and don't be surprised in Philly gets one of the bottom playoff spots and makes some noise in the first couple of rounds.

Can't wait for the upcoming season either. The Sens are looking great, and are gonna get to fly under the radar again it seems for some reason. People are saying "The Sens are gonna struggle this year"! I don't get it, they lost Preissing and Comrie and added Dimitrakos and Richardson. All 4 of these players are non-factors and they are looking great. With Heater and Spezz in contract years, that really seems to elevate players games, and talks about Forsberg would put them at the top on paper, that is if Forsberg can be healthy which is not likely, but perhaps he can give 50 games.

1st line - Spezza, Heatley
2nd line - Alfie, Forsberg

[leftintherough]

...blah....blah....blah!!!!

Nice to see you back! Wife let you out of the bedroom for a post or two ?

[el tigre]

I'm done watching hockey....I've now switched to curling. Life just slows right down once you get married, eh?:D

... though I can see how listening to Colleen Jones yell "Hurry Hard" does have a certain appeal to it!

[golfguy25]

Nice to see you back! Wife let you out of the bedroom for a post or two ?

LOL...things have been really busy since buying our house!! But it's good to see the good old leaf fans stll going at it!:D

[hogannut]

Can't wait for the upcoming season either. The Sens are looking great, and are gonna get to fly under the radar again it seems for some reason. People are saying "The Sens are gonna struggle this year"! I don't get it, they lost Preissing and Comrie and added Dimitrakos and Richardson. All 4 of these players are non-factors and they are looking great. With Heater and Spezz in contract years, that really seems to elevate players games, and talks about Forsberg would put them at the top on paper, that is if Forsberg can be healthy which is not likely, but perhaps he can give 50 games.

1st line - Spezza, Heatley
2nd line - Alfie, Forsberg

If they did pick up Forsberg I would play him sparingly until a month before the playoffs. Ottawa is good enough to do this as well.

[laxgolf]

If they did pick up Forsberg I would play him sparingly until a month before the playoffs. Ottawa is good enough to do this as well.

This thread will never die!!!!

As much as I'd love to see Forsberg in Ottawa, I can't see it happening. I think he'll end up in Detroit. Hopefully Brian Murray can prove me wrong.

How's this for the first PP unit?

Forsberg/Spezza/Heatley
Redden/Corvo

Sick.

[golfguy25]

A month to training camp and look who shows up!!:eek:

GG25....what's happening big guy? Coming to Copetown this weekend? You will be glad to know I'm not supporting the Leafs anymore, at least until they right the ship, which won't happen until they get rid of the teachers union.

Anyway, I will probably watch the Leafs, as I don't have any NHL packages, but I cancelled Leafs TV and won't renew just so I can watch 15 road games against teams that suck as much as the Leafs!:eek:

I'm not jumping on the Sens band wagon though. In fact I think both Ottawa and Buffalo will struggle this upcoming year, compared to last, and Pittsburg will be strong, Rangers will be in there too, and don't be surprised in Philly gets one of the bottom playoff spots and makes some noise in the first couple of rounds.

LOL.....I just saw this guy crying blue and white tears so I figured I would just stir the pot as usual! I don't think that the Sens are going to struggle at all but we will see what hapens for sure.

i will not be at CT this weekend but we should try and get a game in with Steve at some point...well see what going on in the next few weeks or so!

[Trollcifer]

I'm not supporting the Leafs anymore, at least until they right the ship, which won't happen until they get rid of the teachers union.


I don't see how that's a valid arguement anymore? The old arguement was that they couldn't get that player they wanted to put us over the top because of spending limitations imposed by the teachers union.

We now have a salary cap and spend to it's max and are amongst the top in player salaries. It's not the teachers union that's signing these under performing players. It's not the teachers union who insist on signing players who are in the twilight of their careers.

Look no further then the Leaf execs.

With that said, I couldn't ever turn my back on the leafs. Sure, I've lost interest in hockey over the past few years. But I wouldn't just drop loyalty to a team cause they werent winning. I hate glory hunters.

[Golfbum]

I'm done watching hockey....I've now switched to curling.

Hmmmmmmmmmm, do you like hearing "HARD, HARD, HARDER" :rofl:

Women's tennis gets my vote. They grunt loadly ;)

GO SHARKS GO GO SHARKS GO

Oh wait, I totally forgot that this is a "TORONTO GOLF FORUM" and I am not allowed to mention the SHARKS :rolleyes:

[hogannut]

I don't see how that's a valid arguement anymore? The old arguement was that they couldn't get that player they wanted to put us over the top because of spending limitations imposed by the teachers union.

We now have a salary cap and spend to it's max and are amongst the top in player salaries. It's not the teachers union that's signing these under performing players. It's not the teachers union who insist on signing players who are in the twilight of their careers.

Look no further then the Leaf execs.

With that said, I couldn't ever turn my back on the leafs. Sure, I've lost interest in hockey over the past few years. But I wouldn't just drop loyalty to a team cause they werent winning. I hate glory hunters.

Excuse me one moment here!!!! I am NO glory hunter. I watched this team EVERY Saturday night in the 70's - 80's - 90's and supported them 100% of the way. Except for a few gliches in the radar in the late 70's and early 90's (maybe a bit in early 2000's) the only thing consistent with this organization is the fact we the fans were going to be disapointed, yet again.

THe present ownership is no different than Ballard, it matters NOT what kind of team you put out there because the building will be sold out regardless of ticket prices.

Taking a stance against this vicious circle is not "turning your back" on them. If every Leaf fan refused to buy tickets and support TV ratings then and only then would the ownership have to improve the product. Following a team with blind faith may sound like you are a devoted fan, but in fact you are contributing to the never ending losing ways of the organization.

Every other team in every other city suffers from poor attendance when the team doesn't do well. Even big markets like Montreal, Ottawa, New York (for baseball) all have lower attendance when the team doesn't do wel. The only team I can think of that received no questions asked blind faith was the Boston Red Sox and if I have to wait for another 40 years for a championship hockey team in Toronto my care giver will be changing my diapers when the Leafs skate around with the Stanley Cup (Boston went 80 years between championship teams).

I used to buy into this loyalty no matter what thinking....not anymore! I supported you in the lean times, for 30 years, now it's time you honour your fans and put out a contending team, not just once in a while, but year in and year out like organizations like Detroit do!!:eek: :mad:

[laxgolf]

Excuse me one moment here!!!! I am NO glory hunter. I watched this team EVERY Saturday night in the 70's - 80's - 90's and supported them 100% of the way. Except for a few gliches in the radar in the late 70's and early 90's (maybe a bit in early 2000's) the only thing consistent with this organization is the fact we the fans were going to be disapointed, yet again.

THe present ownership is no different than Ballard, it matters NOT what kind of team you put out there because the building will be sold out regardless of ticket prices.

Taking a stance against this vicious circle is not "turning your back" on them. If every Leaf fan refused to buy tickets and support TV ratings then and only then would the ownership have to improve the product. Following a team with blind faith may sound like you are a devoted fan, but in fact you are contributing to the never ending losing ways of the organization.

Every other team in every other city suffers from poor attendance when the team doesn't do well. Even big markets like Montreal, Ottawa, New York (for baseball) all have lower attendance when the team doesn't do wel. The only team I can think of that received no questions asked blind faith was the Boston Red Sox and if I have to wait for another 40 years for a championship hockey team in Toronto my care giver will be changing my diapers when the Leafs skate around with the Stanley Cup (Boston went 80 years between championship teams).

I used to buy into this loyalty no matter what thinking....not anymore! I supported you in the lean times, for 30 years, now it's time you honour your fans and put out a contending team, not just once in a while, but year in and year out like organizations like Detroit do!!:eek: :mad:

I have to agree with you Hogan. Like you said, until fans stop buying tickets, the Leafs will continue to sell out while underperforming. The funny thing is that with the cap every team theoretically has the same amount of dollars to spend. The Leafs did themselves in by handcuffing their cap with a couple of ridiculous contracts. The question is, was it the pension pushing for those deals or JFJ doing it all on his own? At the very least, you'd have to think that JFJ had to go to the board to get approval for the deals. Since I work for a pension-owned company, I know that companies owned by pensions tend to budget until their blue in the face. Knowing your fixed costs over extended periods of time makes for easier long term planning. That's obviously not great for the hockey business, but fantastic for the pension fund.

[hogannut]

I have to agree with you Hogan. Like you said, until fans stop buying tickets, the Leafs will continue to sell out while underperforming. The funny thing is that with the cap every team theoretically has the same amount of dollars to spend. The Leafs did themselves in by handcuffing their cap with a couple of ridiculous contracts. The question is, was it the pension pushing for those deals or JFJ doing it all on his own? At the very least, you'd have to think that JFJ had to go to the board to get approval for the deals. Since I work for a pension-owned company, I know that companies owned by pensions tend to budget until their blue in the face. Knowing your fixed costs over extended periods of time makes for easier long term planning. That's obviously not great for the hockey business, but fantastic for the pension fund.

Yes....JFJ made some mistakes when signing certain players. However, many organizations make bad deals, or mistakes with contracts. THe GOOD organizations are able to get around this and somehow, some way have a decent product on the ice. Detroit loses Yzerman and Shannahan wihtin a couple of years of each other, yet they still had a contending team. Why....because the overall organization is well run.

This is the point I'm at in terms of the Leafs. I no longer am interested in debating whether this guy does his job well, or that player is over paid or whatever, I just want a team I can support that has a realistic chance to be competitive more often than not. After 30 years of disapointment I think my position is fair.

BTW....I like Paul Maurice and hope for his sake the team plays as well as they can, but the lack of talent will become apparent over the 80 game schedule. I also support the Marlies and think it is good entertainment for the ticket price. If you go to a Marlies game ALWAYS buy Mc DOnald's zone tickets for $12. No one ever sits in the seats for all 3 periods. Ricoh is a great little facility and the players are accessible to the kids.

[Bellyhungry]

I hope you were alive in 67 when they last won.

As far as the last 40 years goes, Ricky Bobby says 'If you ain't first, you are last'. Winning a few playoff rounds means very little.

It is not the average fans have to stop buying tickets, it is the corporate support that has to stop. But that is easier said than done, if the support dwindle, all MLSE has to do is to sign one of two has-beens, then the band wagons will be filled up with sucker fans.

As long as the corporate governance of MLSE is driven by profit and not winning, nothing will ever change.

Excuse me one moment here!!!! I am NO glory hunter. I watched this team EVERY Saturday night in the 70's - 80's - 90's and supported them 100% of the way. Except for a few gliches in the radar in the late 70's and early 90's (maybe a bit in early 2000's) the only thing consistent with this organization is the fact we the fans were going to be disapointed, yet again.

THe present ownership is no different than Ballard, it matters NOT what kind of team you put out there because the building will be sold out regardless of ticket prices.

Taking a stance against this vicious circle is not "turning your back" on them. If every Leaf fan refused to buy tickets and support TV ratings then and only then would the ownership have to improve the product. Following a team with blind faith may sound like you are a devoted fan, but in fact you are contributing to the never ending losing ways of the organization.

Every other team in every other city suffers from poor attendance when the team doesn't do well. Even big markets like Montreal, Ottawa, New York (for baseball) all have lower attendance when the team doesn't do wel. The only team I can think of that received no questions asked blind faith was the Boston Red Sox and if I have to wait for another 40 years for a championship hockey team in Toronto my care giver will be changing my diapers when the Leafs skate around with the Stanley Cup (Boston went 80 years between championship teams).

I used to buy into this loyalty no matter what thinking....not anymore! I supported you in the lean times, for 30 years, now it's time you honour your fans and put out a contending team, not just once in a while, but year in and year out like organizations like Detroit do!!:eek: :mad:

[leftintherough]

I have to agree with you Hogan.

Update as per the troll.

We are getting closer and closer to calling HN his name moiniker, snake eyes!

Can't wait till the sticks are assembled!

I hope you were alive in 67 when they last won.



Yup me and HN were alive. Not sure if he reminders, but I just a little hockey puck and faintly remember the big news, then suffered greatly under the ballard regime.


i will not be at CT this weekend but we should try and get a game in with Steve at some point...well see what going on in the next few weeks or so!

That would be great. It would be nice to see a pair of long ball hitters out going toe to toe. I witnessed first hand Scotty nailing one, albeit wind assisted, that measured out at 367 yards off the tee at willow valley this year.

[hogannut]

Update as per the troll.

We are getting closer and closer to calling HN his name moiniker, snake eyes!

Can't wait till the sticks are assembled!



Yup me and HN were alive. Not sure if he reminders, but I just a little hockey puck and faintly remember the big news, then suffered greatly under the ballard regime.



That would be great. It would be nice to see a pair of long ball hitters out going toe to toe. I witnessed first hand Scotty nailing one, albeit wind assisted, that measured out at 367 yards off the tee at willow valley this year.

The last time the Leafs won I was in diapers. Hopefully if they win again I won't be!!:D

[golfguy25]

That would be great. It would be nice to see a pair of long ball hitters out going toe to toe. I witnessed first hand Scotty nailing one, albeit wind assisted, that measured out at 367 yards off the tee at willow valley this year.

LOL...well I definately have a lack of golfing ability noe since getting married and buying a house....so as long as you don't get your hopes up will be be OK!!:rofl:

[hogannut]

LOL.....I just saw this guy crying blue and white tears so I figured I would just stir the pot as usual! I don't think that the Sens are going to struggle at all but we will see what hapens for sure.

i will not be at CT this weekend but we should try and get a game in with Steve at some point...well see what going on in the next few weeks or so!

I have half price coupons for Tarrawandah or whatever just outside of KW good until the end of the year. Steve and I account for 2 of the 4 people, and I have tenatively promised the 3rd spot to a buddy. It will probably be sometime in September closer to the end of Sept. I'll let you know Chad!

[golfguy25]

I have half price coupons for Tarrawandah or whatever just outside of KW good until the end of the year. Steve and I account for 2 of the 4 people, and I have tenatively promised the 3rd spot to a buddy. It will probably be sometime in September closer to the end of Sept. I'll let you know Chad!

Count me in!

[Golfing in Ottawa]

The last time the Leafs won I was in diapers. Hopefully if they win again I won't be!!:D

Come on.......think positive..............I am sure the the Retirement home will have a shuttle bus going to the 80 year Stanley Cup aniversary celebration...........:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Albert Hacker]

The Leafs suck. I mean that sincerely!

[Big Shooter]

The Leafs suck. I mean that sincerely!

...another hater on the TORONTO Golf Nuts forum, ho-hum! :rolleyes:

[leftintherough]

The Leafs suck. I mean that sincerely!

What a fascinating informative post...........Glad you're here Einstein.

[hogannut]

The Leafs suck. I mean that sincerely!

What I think we should do is go to Whitecourt golf nuts and write that their NHL team sucks. OOOps.....they have neither!!:D

[Big Shooter]

What I think we should do is go to Whitecourt...

Is it me, or does the 'pic' of that course not make it look that great!? :$ :(

[hogannut]

It does look like a beautiful golf course. It was the comments I had an issue with.

[Jeffc]

Is it me, or does the 'pic' of that course not make it look that great!? :$ :(

well, I can't believe I'm agreeing with Big Shooter :D but I agree. All I see are 90% trees and part of one kinda brown fairway.....

[wayland]

LOL...well I definately have a lack of golfing ability noe since getting married and buying a house....so as long as you don't get your hopes up will be be OK!!:rofl:

Wow you still play golf? I thought all you did these days was play poker. It's funny that I met you on this site but have never seen you play golf (aside from the golf sim at Paul's place).

I think you should invite the tgn ppl to the thing on the 29th. I want to win a larger prize :D

[Albert Hacker]

Leaf fans, I appreciate all the positive feedback!! :D

And yes sadly, this will be yet another season of dispair for the Maple "Laughs". ;)

I don't have any idea how my Edmonton Oilers will fare. Kevin Lowe has confused the **** out of me. I have no idea if he's an idiot or a genius right now... :confused:

[hogannut]

Leaf fans, I appreciate all the positive feedback!! :D

And yes sadly, this will be yet another season of dispair for the Maple "Laughs". ;)

I don't have any idea how my Edmonton Oilers will fare. Kevin Lowe has confused the **** out of me. I have no idea if he's an idiot or a genius right now... :confused:

It's funny because the year you guys went to the finals most hockey fans in Canada were cheering you guys on. I wonder if that would be happen if the Leafs made it and the Oilers were out? Why can't you just be an Oiler's fan, why is it necessary to bash? I don't like the Leafs chances this year to go much further than the 1st round, but I don't bash other teams, so why do you?:confused:

[leftintherough]

Leaf fans, I appreciate all the positive feedback!! :D


Hey make a troll comment get hacked. The "leaf sucks" comments should solely be directed at the foolish fanatics that claim the leafs are going all the way this year.

[guitarman]

The "leaf sucks" comments should solely be directed at the foolish fanatics that claim the leafs are going all the way this year.

I doubt there are any of those left. But if the leafs get in the playoffs and win the first game of the first round, the "foolish, leafs are going all the way", fans will be out in full force.

[leftintherough]

....and win the first game of the first round, the "foolish, leafs are going all the way", fans will be out in full force.

Too true! However they will fodder for the Sens faithful here.

[Albert Hacker]

I love trash talking other guys teams. :)


For the record I am a fan of:
Edmonton Oilers
San Diego Chargers
Toronto Blue Jays

PGA players I like:
Woody Austin
Geoff Ogilvy
Steve Stricker
Ernie Els
David Duval
Tim Herron
Vijay Singh (I like the fact that the man always shows up!)
Mike Weir
John Daly

I don't like Mickelson. TW wins way too often; a good tourney is when he's in 15th (they still show every shot as if he's winning the damn thing)

[golfguy25]

Wow you still play golf? I thought all you did these days was play poker. It's funny that I met you on this site but have never seen you play golf (aside from the golf sim at Paul's place).

I think you should invite the tgn ppl to the thing on the 29th. I want to win a larger prize :D

Well then we should get out for a round of golf then at some point!

I may very well invite a few people, I want to see how many I can get and then fill in the rest

[guitarman]

TW wins way too often;

Thats the think about trash talkers. They have the stupidest reasons for not liking someone. So if any one your favourite list starts winning too much they go to the hate list?

[Albert Hacker]

^ I admit I was excited when TW came on tour and earned a pro card in like 6 events. How incredible is that?

I am not questioning TW talent in any way, I just enjoy pulling for the under-dog.

I also hate