The Whites or the Blues?

[Twi-light Launcher]

I've always wondered about this. I'm an 18 handicap - I hit the ball pretty well (drives land about 240-250) but, as you would expect from my handicap, I'm also prone to chunking the odd ball, or sending one into the cabbage, or three putting, etc...

I generally hit from the whites - unless I get thrown in with some guys that hit from the blues and I just follow suit. On some courses, like Chedoke in Hamilton, Don Valley, Streetsville, even Lakeview, I feel that I should be hitting from the blues. From the whites, I'm looking at a lot of 360 yard par 4s.

On other courses I've played, like King's Forest in Hamilton, St. Andew's Valley, Shawneeki, and Lionhead, I feel that, if I played from the blues, I might be in danger of disrupting the pace of play.

Is there a bright line test for which tees to play from? Is it based on handicap, length off the tee, or the course yardage? Can I do the blues at some courses and the whites at others?

[thecoach]

It's not the colour of the tees (many courses are changing them) it's a combination of the rating and slope you should be looking at. Find a course where you know it's a good fit for your game and look at the rating (say 71.2). The try to play courses (tees) with simlar ratings (say 70-72). The same for slope - if your fit is a 123 slope, try to play tees that are 121 to 125.

Rating and slope determine difficulty and are used for handicap purposes - so they are a good indication of the toughness (or lack of) of the course.

Hope that helps.

[noback]

Alot of courses will actually have a sign on or near the first tee that has suggestions on where to play from. ei. 0- 10 handicap from the blues 11-20 from the whites etc...

As an 18 handicap I would say you should be on the whites.:D

[laxgolf]

I've always wondered about this. I'm an 18 handicap - I hit the ball pretty well (drives land about 240-250) but, as you would expect from my handicap, I'm also prone to chunking the odd ball, or sending one into the cabbage, or three putting, etc...

I generally hit from the whites - unless I get thrown in with some guys that hit from the blues and I just follow suit. On some courses, like Chedoke in Hamilton, Don Valley, Streetsville, even Lakeview, I feel that I should be hitting from the blues. From the whites, I'm looking at a lot of 360 yard par 4s.

On other courses I've played, like King's Forest in Hamilton, St. Andew's Valley, Shawneeki, and Lionhead, I feel that, if I played from the blues, I might be in danger of disrupting the pace of play.

Is there a bright line test for which tees to play from? Is it based on handicap, length off the tee, or the course yardage? Can I do the blues at some courses and the whites at others?
It should be based on level of skill, but sometimes handicap isn't the best judge of what tees to play. Someone can be horrible off the tee but have an amazing short game that saves their butts. Personally I look at two things; length of par 3's and overall length of course from each tee. Personally, I like to play courses in the 6400-6700 range and don't like 220+ yard par 3's.

[Ego Woods]

General rule is that the longer the course is, the more difficult it is....

It's great that your a bomber, but scoring is the end result....signficant difference if you have to hit a 4-5 iron from your approach shot compared to a 7-iron if you were playing on the more fwd tees....

Unless u play like Chris DiMarco. :)

[golferboy]

I would focus on the course rating or slope instead of the color of the tee blocks....Distance is only half the battle on most courses.

[Twi-light Launcher]

That's the thing .... I play from the whites, hit solid drives and leave myself with 9 irons to the green. From there, I score pars or bogeys. If I played from the blues, and had to hit even a 6 iron in, I'd be scoring only the occasional par, lots of bogeys and a substantial number of doubles.

From the whites, I can boast that I shot an 84 or an 86 but, in reality, I can't hit a mid-iron if my life depended on it (don't even get me started on low-irons).

[Focker Singh]

I agree with Laxgolf. I usually go by the yardage and personally I like the 6500 range. If thats the tips at one course it doesn't matter to me. Its could also be the 2nd set of blocks on another.
One thing you can do is to ask the marshal before you start your round and ask him what a 18 handicap should play. Good luck.

[Greywolf]

That's the thing .... I play from the whites, hit solid drives and leave myself with 9 irons to the green. From there, I score pars or bogeys. If I played from the blues, and had to hit even a 6 iron in, I'd be scoring only the occasional par, lots of bogeys and a substantial number of doubles.

From the whites, I can boast that I shot an 84 or an 86 but, in reality, I can't hit a mid-iron if my life depended on it (don't even get me started on low-irons).

If that is the case, often hitting 9 irons, then maybe you should go back 1 set of tees on that particular course. Like the others have said, distance of the tees is not always the reason why a course is difficult, it is more about the difficulties you may encounter while playing a course. I suppose that you are having problems with mid irons since you do not get to use them very much.

[tjhayko]

Hmm, based on ability, I should probably play from the whites, however, I often end up playing from the blues because my normal playing buddies hit the ball quite a bit further than I do. However, I have shot a personal best from the blue tees, and I am able to usually keep up the pace of play. Shouldn't pace of play be the real determining factor? I do adjust my expectations of my score up a bit when I play from the blues.

[Grass Roots Tour]

Its always a good idea to play as often as possible with players better than you. This is a good way to learn what shots to play around the greens.
Better players can also show you a lot about course management to help you learn to keep the BIG numbers off the scorecard.
If it means you need to play longer tees sometimes to join a group of better players, I think its worth it. Just watch your ball closely till it stops rolling so you never have to look for it and no one will mind you not scoring as they do.

I wouldn't always play short courses or tees leaving yourself never practicing the longer clubs in your bag. How are you going to learn something you never do?

Just my 2 cents.

[Titan]

I'm not sure why but I generally score less from the longer blocks? I think it is more psychological. When playing from the longer blocks I know I will need definitely 2 shots (or more) to reach the green. I fell less pressure getting of a rocket of a drive. When I'm closer I can't help but think green off the blocks (not all holes of course) and end up trying to stretch my drive (which tends to put me in more harm). Plus I find I get to use all the clubs in my bag appose to driver wedge driver wedge. (even though I need wedge practice).

[Big Shooter]

I play to about a 13 handicap, but WE ALWAYS play from the tips. [except sometimes on the first tee, if it's busy and the Starter is in a bad mood!]

...as my buddy (7 handicap) says, "they've got our money, might as well play the WHOLE course!"

I do play the 'up tees' if I'm playing with a group I don't know, and let the majority rule
...or if I'm playing with my Dad (gotta give him some hope!):p

[Grass Roots Tour]

My posse likes to tote the "play the whole course" motto as well.

[Special_K]

My buddy uses the "the architect designed the course with the backs in mind and not from the front" argument.

[pudubny]

My buddy uses the "the architect designed the course with the backs in mind and not from the front" argument.
Not a good architect. The "tips" is a very obscure idea. For example, Angus Glen can be played up to 7500 yards. But on any given day could also play only 6900 from the tips depending on tee settings and pin placements. And that is what the designer, Doug Carrick intended. Gives the course more variety in setting strategies and hazards. Also allows the course to make settings based on weather conditions and the group using the course. Donald Ross, creator of Pinehurst and many other great courses in fact designed courses from the green backwards to the tees and many have followed in his footsteps.
Good architects design the course with all handicaps and tee blocks in mind. Where the obsticles and strategy are equally effect all levels of play. They have studies that show average distances different levels of players hit the ball. GOOD architects use this information. Many BAD designers do not.
If you still do not buy into this idea, read any extensive interview with Pete Dye. He started out his career with this idea that the "tips" was all that is important. His wife Alice showed him why that was wrong.
I think all golf enthusiasts should really understand golf architecture, it helps you understand so much about playing the game. Sadly good designs and designers are rarely understood or appreciated.
Perhaps you can now convince your "buddy" he is misguided.
That's my rant.
Pud.

[boss of the moss]

I've always wondered about this. I'm an 18 handicap - I hit the ball pretty well (drives land about 240-250) but, as you would expect from my handicap, I'm also prone to chunking the odd ball, or sending one into the cabbage, or three putting, etc...

I generally hit from the whites - unless I get thrown in with some guys that hit from the blues and I just follow suit. On some courses, like Chedoke in Hamilton, Don Valley, Streetsville, even Lakeview, I feel that I should be hitting from the blues. From the whites, I'm looking at a lot of 360 yard par 4s.

On other courses I've played, like King's Forest in Hamilton, St. Andew's Valley, Shawneeki, and Lionhead, I feel that, if I played from the blues, I might be in danger of disrupting the pace of play.

Is there a bright line test for which tees to play from? Is it based on handicap, length off the tee, or the course yardage? Can I do the blues at some courses and the whites at others?
In my opinion, you should play from the set of tees where you would most enjoy the game. Be it blues or whites. Most people often feel they always have to play from the tips every time they tee it up. What fun is it hitting driver- 3 wood in to every par 4? It isn't. A nice variety is more enjoyable. I sometimes move forward a deck or two to play a course from a different set of yardages. Makes for a different game if your playing the same course regularly.

[Greywolf]

In my opinion, you should play from the set of tees where you would most enjoy the game. Be it blues or whites. Most people often feel they always have to play from the tips every time they tee it up. What fun is it hitting driver- 3 wood in to every par 4? It isn't. A nice variety is more enjoyable. I sometimes move forward a deck or two to play a course from a different set of yardages. Makes for a different game if your playing the same course regularly.

I agree.

That can be a drain all day long.

[Big Shooter]

Not a good architect. The "tips" is a very obscure idea. .


You're absolutely right, proof is how many course are now "lengthening" holes, especially for Pro Tournaments.;)

[hammer]

I generally go by the length of the course. I generally look for about 6500 - 6800 yards. Which ever tees fall into that catagory is what I play. I also look for par 3's. If there are par 3's over 210 from the back tees I won't play them simply because I can't hit anything that long with enough accuracy so whats the point. Some courses are tough though where they have a few super long par 3's and some short par 4's. I preffer to play up a set on these courses cause its much more fun to drive par 4 greens than it is to hit long par 3 greens.

I also find I enjoy golf more playing up a set since my scores are generally lower. I couldn't care less about the whole ego thing about the back tees and 90% of the golfers I have ever played with should be off the back tees. If you play the backs and shoot 100 that should tell people something.

[Andru]

I play all of the tee blocks it's a great way to dial in your game. Especially if you tend to play the same course all of the time. The course I play has 4 tee decks. I've played the whites, blues and golds. All present a different challenge.

Don't worry so much. play something beyond what you believe your abilites are you may surprise yourself. Besides how are you going to get better staying in your comfort zone? You need to bust out and challenge yourself.

Oddly enough some of my highest scores this year have some from the whites. It's not always easier. :-) Ok it's just my refusal to hit the chicken stick vs. the driver.

[phizzat]

In my opinion, I think if you can hit your 7-Iron 150yrds and drive 230yrds consistently, you are good to go from blue (6500yrds). Otherwise, you'll probably find the length much too difficult to overcome.

[duffer_devon]

Jack Nicklaus has long said that golfers play the wrong set of tees and if it were up to him, all amateurs would start out from the reds. His philosophy was that you have to get used to shooting low scores and once you do that then you can move back a deck.

I see it every week on my Tour, where the "A" flight guys want to play the tips instead of 6200-6400 that we normally play then they can't break 80.

I don't know about you folks but I like breaking 80 and no one asks me what tees I played from just what I shot.

[Titan]

Jack Nicklaus has long said that golfers play the wrong set of tees and if it were up to him, all amateurs would start out from the reds. His philosophy was that you have to get used to shooting low scores and once you do that then you can move back a deck.

I see it every week on my Tour, where the "A" flight guys want to play the tips instead of 6200-6400 that we normally play then they can't break 80.

I don't know about you folks but I like breaking 80 and no one asks me what tees I played from just what I shot.
What deck do you play from ?

[KingCobra]

I actually heard that quite a few courses went as far as to move the blues to white, because evrybody wants to say they "play from the blue tips" thus still actually having people that should be playing golf from the white, golfing white tip yardage. Myself I'll usually play the whites, unless the group I'm with plays the blues.:$

[duffer_devon]

What deck do you play from ?
It depends on the length of the course. Whatever tee deck is 6200 - 6400 yards, then I look at the rating/slope of the course.
Best round I ever played was at National Pines (Blue) and joined with a guy and his wife. Guy played Gold (6500 yards) and I decided not to join him and shot one under for the first 12 holes and 79 overall (never mind the two triples and double).
Don't get bullied into the back tees. Those who want to see the entire course, usually do.

[circuithacker]

I dunno....I suck, but I can play the longest course going, and not hold anybody up. I realize that I am unlikely to hit the ball 350 yards, so I don't wait until the group ahead are that far away. I don't take a pile of practice swings, and walk at a decent pace. Pace of play has little to do with how well you play....within reason.

[duffer den]

Great discussion as I have often thought about this and just in the past year or so have switched from playing whites to blues. I haven't been concerned with color so much as with length and slope as that has been my guide. I do have to say, though, that far too often do I see guys at the wrong tee (usually blue) and it is a contributing factor to slow play, though their wayward tee shots would be just as bad from white or anywhere else.

My switch to blues has largely been a result of increasing the challenge and the fact that I got a new driver last year, and new irons this year. My game has improved enough to warrant the change and equipment is a definite part of it, mostly because my old clubs were so bad, though I was still able to score pretty well with them (80s, low 90s). Over the last 2-3 years I have consistently been in the 80s, and that has continued, even with the tee switch.

One course that has an interesting take on the yardage system and tees is: http://www.hawktree.com/CourseInfo/YardageSystem.htm. I had seen this quite some time ago and thought it was a good idea.

[iyell4]

i'm a 21hc and like to play from the furthest back tees all the time so i can
'see the whole course' ...
get the most value for my limited golfing dollars ...
reduce my cost per stroke by jacking up the # of strokes i take outta this track.
my favorite part is the pleasant stroll in the woods searching for tee shot (the rulz DO provide me with 10 minutes, right?)

[Golftool]

Your the reason i just hit and play through without asking - by time you find your ball i've already putted out and on the next tee! - 6hr+ must be an average round for you! -

[pudubny]

i'm a 21hc and like to play from the furthest back tees all the time so i can
'see the whole course' ...
get the most value for my limited golfing dollars ...
reduce my cost per stroke by jacking up the # of strokes i take outta this track.
my favorite part is the pleasant stroll in the woods searching for tee shot (the rulz DO provide me with 10 minutes, right?)

Please
We politely request you read the following instructional guide, courtesy of your friends at the forum.
http://www.torontogolfnuts.com/showthread.php?t=883
I hope that sense of humour is sarcastic.
Good luck.
Pud.

[mirak]

I think courses should have posted what the expected handicap should be matched with the respective tees. If you are 30+ hit from Reds, etc...

People always tend to blame the guys in front for being slow, but many times we fail to realize that it may be two or three groups ahead what's causing the problem. Still we get upset and decide to "show those guys in front" a lesson, and hit it close. I had a group hit they approach shots when we were still in the green a few weeks ago, they almost hit one of my friends (of course they didn't yell "fore") When they got to the green, were teeing off the next hole, we mentioned that they almost hit us, expecting at least a "sorry", instead the guys just said "so". Let me tell you, it took some deep breathing not to start a fight there...
As many have said, we should be playing golf with the intention of having a good time.... golf rage is becoming an everyday thing

[Grass Roots Tour]

MIRAK is right and I think these types of problems are going to get far worse before they get better. Golf courses are getting rid of golf pros in favour of general managers who often know absolutely nothing about golf ettiquette. Even IF they do know, they never come in contact with enough golfers to teach them anything about whats expected.

Whats more is that soo many new golfers with no one with any knowledge about how the game is supposed to be played to teach them. In the end, the new golfers may not be at fault. If they never learn whats expected and why, they'll never know.

Our game is changing so fast some hardly even notice. 20 years ago it was common place to see several singles hanging around the practice tee or putting green waiting for a game. Nowadays, every group has four or isn't interested in having someone join them anyway.

This is going to get worse IMHO

[openflows]

I play from whatever tee block I feel comfortable with that day, or what my playing partners want to. This ranges from blue, to white, to red. The beauty is it doesn't really matter which tee you play from, as the difference in slope and rating is reflected in the calculation of your handicap anyhow. The other benefit of playing from different tees is it helps encourage the development of different parts of your game as you hit approach shots from different parts of the course(s).

[the_har]

I go by the par threes. If you can comfortably land it on the green from the blue tees, then that's what you could play from. a perfect example is from the tips or the blues. For example if a par three from the tips is about 220 and you cannot land it softly on the green, than you shouldn't be playing from those tees. But if from the blues it's about 190-200 and you can land it softly, than that's the tee box for you. REMEMBER - GREEN IN REGULATION ON A PAR THREE MEANS THAT YOU CAN LAND IT ON IN 1 STROKE.

[westbeach]

I'll play whatever tee deck I feel I can score the best from. Why? B/c if I shoot 70, I shot 70. When I move back, if I'm close to shooting 70, I'll know the feeling from before and not be in a "no man's zone"

[Golftool]

Usually play from the blues! I can't understand ANY person playing from golds (tips)who is not scratch or better!. We played last week (2 some) and were joined at last minute (after we teed off) on the first hole by another 2 some. They proceeded to tee off from the tips. Not one of them hit the fairway for the first 4 holes! Come to think of it they didnt play on the shot stuff at all and didnt even hit GIR. It wasnt until the fifth hole that they decided to play with us from the blues (we were even par at that point and they both had to be +5 or +6 easily). Just because you can hit a driver 280+yds (+50 or 60yds into the bush) doesn't mean you should play from the back tees! :mad: Its the whole game that counts!;)

[BdaGolfer]

Just because you can hit a driver 280+yds (+50 or 60yds into the bush) doesn't mean you should play from the back tees! :mad: Its the whole game that counts!;)
I agree - but at least being able to hit it that far is a bonus. I played Whirlpool a couple of weeks ago with my wife, and we were paired up with an older couple from Ohio. I said I was going to play the blues (6,700 yds), and the old guy said he would play whites, as he wasn't a long hitter, so I'm fine with that. I tee off, hit one down the middle leaving a mid-iron approach, and am about to walk forward toward the whites when the old guy says he'll play the blues after all. He then steps up and pipes one about 140yds :mad: I knew it was going to be a long day...

Thankfully, after failing to reach any green in 2 on the front (including the par 3's) he moves up to the whites for the back and has a much better time.

Remember people - the tee boxes are like traffic lights - the color is just a guideline :)

Alan

[iyell4]

I agree - but at least being able to hit it that far is a bonus.
it can get monotonous if you're constantly playing:
driver, wedge, 2-putt on the par fours.
*yawn!*

[BdaGolfer]

it can get monotonous if you're constantly playing:
driver, wedge, 2-putt on the par fours.
*yawn!*
You should move back to the blues then :D But seriously, I know how dull that can be. Fortunately for me I have the distance but not the control, so my 2nd shots are rarely boring wedges :p

Alan

[iyell4]

You should move back to the blues then :D But seriously, I know how dull that can be. Fortunately for me I have the distance but not the control, so my 2nd shots are rarely boring wedges :p

Alan
if you kept your eye on the ball and not your avatar you might hit a few more fairways!;)

[mikemakeitso]

it can get monotonous if you're constantly playing:
driver, wedge, 2-putt on the par fours.
*yawn!*
... Oh Yeah, Everyone would really get bored 2 putting for par... When I get on a roll like this, it's NOT boredom I feel - it's pure exhileration... :cool:

[BdaGolfer]

if you kept your eye on the ball and not your avatar you might hit a few more fairways!;)
If I thought about my avatar on the course I think there would be the occassional temporary immovable obstruction in play and there's no relief from that in the rule book :D

Alan

[iyell4]

i like the idea of using the lengths of the par-3's to determine which blocks to play from. i'm gonna start doin' that for all the courses i've already played. however, if i'm playing a course that i've never played before, i'm still gonna wanna 'see the whole course'. ... it just makes sense to 'see the whole course' at least once!

[mordillo]

What about streaky golfers? Do people think they should adjust mid-round as they see where their score is heading, or pick a set of tees in advance and tough it out or eat the course alive depending on the day. I personally don't find the distance intimidating on most courses, but on poor driving days or weak iron days the distance just exacerbates the mistakes and the big numbers.

When I'm on, on an average 430yd par 4 I play 300 yd 1W and 130 yd AW or when the fairways is tight 240 yd 2I and 190 yd 6I. However, on bad days I'm looking at 270 yd drives into the woods followed by chip outs and 7I approaches to greens from the rough, leading to bogeys and doubles. I feel the difference in time between scenarios is quite substantial, but often you don't know what kind of day it is until the middle of the round, or the day changes from one to the other (ususally for worse) as you go along.

I'd love to hear some suggestions.

[playadraw]

I think that you need to play from the tees that best suit your overall game.

I have played rounds with guys who were playing from the whites and shot in the mid 70s and go on like they should be on the tour.

However, I will play from the blues, shoot an 81, and have them tell me they beat me.

You need to get an accurate account of your handicap which is based not only on yardage but but the course slope.

I played a course last year in Michigan that was only 6349 yards but the slope was 139.

I believe you can go on the OGA website and calculate your handicap.

My friend does ours because the three of us have been palying together for 20 years.

[golferboy]

I know that Tangle Creek used to do that last year..great idea.I think courses should have posted what the expected handicap should be matched with the respective tees. If you are 30+ hit from Reds, etc...

People always tend to blame the guys in front for being slow, but many times we fail to realize that it may be two or three groups ahead what's causing the problem. Still we get upset and decide to "show those guys in front" a lesson, and hit it close. I had a group hit they approach shots when we were still in the green a few weeks ago, they almost hit one of my friends (of course they didn't yell "fore") When they got to the green, were teeing off the next hole, we mentioned that they almost hit us, expecting at least a "sorry", instead the guys just said "so". Let me tell you, it took some deep breathing not to start a fight there...
As many have said, we should be playing golf with the intention of having a good time.... golf rage is becoming an everyday thing