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Some iron math/geometry

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  • Some iron math/geometry

    If any one interested, here is some irons geometry i did last night for a "standard" irons (3i vs PW).
    click on link to see enlarged picture.
    Cheers !

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/145066...in/photostream
    Last edited by veryold; Nov 23, 2016, 10:17 AM.
    “Golf is a game whose aim is to hit a very small ball into an even smaller hole, with weapons singularly ill-designed for the purpose”
    Winston S. Churchill

  • #2
    Re: Some iron math/geometry

    Trying to go TLT?
    I am listening. Please elaborate.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Some iron math/geometry

      Originally posted by Tintin View Post
      Trying to go TLT?
      I am listening. Please elaborate.
      No
      Was just curious with all this talk about SL, TLT and such, to see what a "conventional set" of irons look like in their geometry. And thought that some may be interested. And also, how much a PW had to be made upright, or extended, while keeping its original lie, to be the same height as the regular 3i (probably should've used a 6i instead of the 3i for this). That's all.
      Cheers !
      Last edited by veryold; Nov 23, 2016, 05:14 PM.
      “Golf is a game whose aim is to hit a very small ball into an even smaller hole, with weapons singularly ill-designed for the purpose”
      Winston S. Churchill

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Some iron math/geometry

        Originally posted by veryold View Post
        If any one interested, here is some irons geometry i did last night for a "standard" irons (3i vs PW).
        click on link to see enlarged picture.
        Cheers !

        https://www.flickr.com/photos/145066...in/photostream

        You might want to try "Paint.net" or something similar it will produce much better schematics, like with straight lines and nice curves plus the absolutely correct angles.
        CHEERS

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Some iron math/geometry

          Interesting concept re: the geometry of the irons. I always felt that the total trajectory that the ball travelled after impact was pretty much the same for all irons - somewhere in the 260 yard range. Take into account the lower trajectory of a 3 iron and the elongated flight parabola as opposed to the higher trajectory of the 9 iron and the cone shaped flight pattern. The 3 iron may slowly rise from impact a distance of 110 yards and to a height of 40 yards and then descend the other 110 yards for a total distance from you af 220 yards with a total travel distance of 260 ; the 9 iron rises much faster, away from you 70 yards out to a height of 120 yards and then 70 yards down for a 140 yard total distance with 260 yard travel....it actually holds true for all the irons.....

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Some iron math/geometry

            Originally posted by veryold View Post
            If any one interested, here is some irons geometry i did last night for a "standard" irons (3i vs PW).
            click on link to see enlarged picture.
            Cheers !

            https://www.flickr.com/photos/145066...in/photostream
            Originally posted by veryold View Post
            No
            Was just curious with all this talk about SL, TLT and such, to see what a "conventional set" of irons look like in their geometry. And thought that some may be interested. And also, how much a PW had to be made upright, or extended, while keeping its original lie, to be the same height as the regular 3i (probably should've used a 6i instead of the 3i for this). That's all.
            Cheers !
            But what are you measuring, and more importantly, what am I [I]looking at[I], exactly? I'm looking at this, and all I see is that some arbitrary "C" pitching wedge, should be 5.2* different from pitching wedge "B". Are you saying it has to be flatter, more upright? Why? What are inches "D" and "E" representing? Are you saying there is a 1.5 inch difference between 3 iron "A" and pitching wedge "C", in an ideal set? Making the effective length of a pitching wedge ~= to a modern stat 6 iron?

            I think it is important to get a correct lie angle down for every player, however, that is only going to help them so much. I mean I can manipulate an iron's lie angle simply by manipulating the position of my hands in relation to my body. But if I am chronic fader/drawer of the ball and want to minimize that effect, lie angle will play a minor role in that correction. However, swing path, ball position, and ultimately face orientation at impact are all going to be massively more instrumental in the direction the ball flies than the length and lie of a golf club.
            Ping G30 LST
            Callaway XR Pro
            Taylormade R15 TP
            Nike Vapor Flex 20* hybrid
            Mizuno JPX900 Forged 5-PW
            Miura 50*
            Engage Toe Sweep 55*
            Engage Square Sole 59*
            Ping Anser TR1966

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Some iron math/geometry

              my response in blue.
              Originally posted by Phatchrisrules View Post
              But what are you measuring, and more importantly, what am I [I]looking at[I], exactly?
              i just wanted to see, for a conventional set, what mods are required to a PW to achieve the same WTF height as the 3i, by:
              1) making lie of PW more upright and
              2) keeping the lie, but extending the shaft


              I think it is important to get a correct lie angle down for every player, however, that is only going to help them so much. I mean I can manipulate an iron's lie angle simply by manipulating the position of my hands in relation to my body. But if I am chronic fader/drawer of the ball and want to minimize that effect, lie angle will play a minor role in that correction. However, swing path, ball position, and ultimately face orientation at impact are all going to be massively more instrumental in the direction the ball flies than the length and lie of a golf club.
              Agree, but again, people are reporting on these forums how minute difference in lie/length makes a tremendous improvement in their ball striking performance.
              “Golf is a game whose aim is to hit a very small ball into an even smaller hole, with weapons singularly ill-designed for the purpose”
              Winston S. Churchill

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Some iron math/geometry

                If you look at my slides 4 and 5
                http://www.danscustomgolfshop.com/un...h-and-lie.html
                This is what I believe old is trying to explain - only difference is that I am showing the deviation at the head end.

                I believe it was an attempt to understand the differences that live in the height of the top of the grips 3 vs wedge - indicating that the more upright the long club - the higher the address position will have to be to accommodate.

                Slide 4 shows the opposite end of the club where the specifications are 1/2 inch length / club and 1/2 degree lie change per club. If your wedge was right - your 3 iron is sunk deep in the ground (to be parallel), or slide 5 shows the reality that the toe will be way too upright when addressed athletically.

                I applaud the old fella for taking the time to try to understand and explain the math.
                Regards
                Dan

                Dan's Custom Golf Shop - Sponsor
                True Length Technology TM
                Awarded 'Best New Fitting Idea - 2007 AGCP'
                True Frequency Technology TM
                - Developer / Owner

                Maltby Clubmaking Academy
                - Master
                Golf Clubmakers Association (GCA)
                - Advanced / Professional
                Professional Clubmakers Society (PCS)
                - Class 'A'

                Phone : 905-263-8510
                Hampton, ON
                Appointment only
                Web site www.truelengthtechnology.com
                E-mail: danscustomgolfshop@hotmail.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Some iron math/geometry

                  Originally posted by Phatchrisrules View Post
                  But what are you measuring, and more importantly, what am I [I]looking at[I], exactly? I'm looking at this, and all I see is that some arbitrary "C" pitching wedge, should be 5.2* different from pitching wedge "B". Are you saying it has to be flatter, more upright? Why? What are inches "D" and "E" representing? Are you saying there is a 1.5 inch difference between 3 iron "A" and pitching wedge "C", in an ideal set? Making the effective length of a pitching wedge ~= to a modern stat 6 iron?

                  I think it is important to get a correct lie angle down for every player, however, that is only going to help them so much. I mean I can manipulate an iron's lie angle simply by manipulating the position of my hands in relation to my body. But if I am chronic fader/drawer of the ball and want to minimize that effect, lie angle will play a minor role in that correction. However, swing path, ball position, and ultimately face orientation at impact are all going to be massively more instrumental in the direction the ball flies than the length and lie of a golf club.
                  I consider length and lie to be a major factor in correcting directional control issues. Yes your other 3 factors do play roles, but if the toe is up the face is not pointing down the fairway (it's aimed left), just as if the toe is down the face is now aimed right. Swing path, ball position, and ultimately face orientation all have some responsibility, but length and lie cannot be discounted as minor.
                  Regards
                  Dan

                  Dan's Custom Golf Shop - Sponsor
                  True Length Technology TM
                  Awarded 'Best New Fitting Idea - 2007 AGCP'
                  True Frequency Technology TM
                  - Developer / Owner

                  Maltby Clubmaking Academy
                  - Master
                  Golf Clubmakers Association (GCA)
                  - Advanced / Professional
                  Professional Clubmakers Society (PCS)
                  - Class 'A'

                  Phone : 905-263-8510
                  Hampton, ON
                  Appointment only
                  Web site www.truelengthtechnology.com
                  E-mail: danscustomgolfshop@hotmail.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Some iron math/geometry

                    Originally posted by danscustomgolfshop View Post
                    I applaud the old fella for taking the time to try to understand and explain the math.
                    You made my day
                    Cheers !
                    “Golf is a game whose aim is to hit a very small ball into an even smaller hole, with weapons singularly ill-designed for the purpose”
                    Winston S. Churchill

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Some iron math/geometry

                      Originally posted by veryold View Post
                      You made my day
                      Cheers !

                      Make his now. Book an appointment

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Some iron math/geometry

                        Originally posted by danscustomgolfshop View Post
                        If you look at my slides 4 and 5
                        http://www.danscustomgolfshop.com/un...h-and-lie.html
                        This is what I believe old is trying to explain - only difference is that I am showing the deviation at the head end.

                        I believe it was an attempt to understand the differences that live in the height of the top of the grips 3 vs wedge - indicating that the more upright the long club - the higher the address position will have to be to accommodate.

                        Slide 4 shows the opposite end of the club where the specifications are 1/2 inch length / club and 1/2 degree lie change per club. If your wedge was right - your 3 iron is sunk deep in the ground (to be parallel), or slide 5 shows the reality that the toe will be way too upright when addressed athletically.

                        I applaud the old fella for taking the time to try to understand and explain the math.
                        Originally posted by Tintin View Post
                        Make his now. Book an appointment
                        Ya never know
                        Cheers !
                        “Golf is a game whose aim is to hit a very small ball into an even smaller hole, with weapons singularly ill-designed for the purpose”
                        Winston S. Churchill

                        Comment

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