Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

[Arthur Dailey]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

It's funny but we thought exactly this today. We booked 10:48 at Glen Cedars and when we pulled in the parking lot was jammed. I was hoping there was a business meeting booked and not all golfers. We assumed we'd fly around on a Tuesday after Labour day but it turned out Tuesdays are play all day for $39.
The pro shop told me there were no worries about pace as they were coming in after 9 in 2 hours. Well it was a Sh1t show! 2.5 hours for the front and the back was much worse so we packed it in early.
The marshal said he works for a 4.5 hour pace. That's way too long for this course.
Bottom line? Yes they filled the tee sheet with bargain hunters but lost the business of people who were willing to pay a fair dollar for a reasonable pace. We should have gone down the road to Cherry Downs once we saw the parking lot. Live and learn.

I feel your pain.

But what is better for the course, having a nearly empty tee sheet at full price or a full one at a discounted rate?

Guess it depends on their business model.

The number of rounds being played is shrinking.

This year we have actually had a couple of new courses open in the north-east GTA, although they are aimed different markets.

And this is still considered 'high season'. University/college classes haven't started yet.

[QuentinJJ]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

It's funny but we thought exactly this today. We booked 10:48 at Glen Cedars and when we pulled in the parking lot was jammed. I was hoping there was a business meeting booked and not all golfers. We assumed we'd fly around on a Tuesday after Labour day but it turned out Tuesdays are play all day for $39.
The pro shop told me there were no worries about pace as they were coming in after 9 in 2 hours. Well it was a Sh1t show! 2.5 hours for the front and the back was much worse so we packed it in early.
The marshal said he works for a 4.5 hour pace. That's way too long for this course.
Bottom line? Yes they filled the tee sheet with bargain hunters but lost the business of people who were willing to pay a fair dollar for a reasonable pace. We should have gone down the road to Cherry Downs once we saw the parking lot. Live and learn.

If you discount too much, those that can pay will wait for the deals too and no one will pay rack rate.

[johnny canuck]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

50 green fees at $40 a pop is much better than 10 at $100, especially when you factor in food, drink, pro shop spend, etc...

One of the top courses nearby struggled for years, trying to charge $60-$65 a head. They lowered their fees to $40 across the board and business honestly went up 400%. Naturally, they jacked the prices a few years later and are completely dead all week.

The "discount" model that works well over here is green fees + cart + lunch + pint. People end up paying more than they would rack rate with the extras attached. Has that crept into play at all?

[Big Shooter]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

Less $ per round might mean people play more total rounds.

Certainly does for me

Most of the good deals to be had are on non busy times.

Agreed....I have the--almost useless Greensfee Passport--weekend 'deals' are almost always 2-for-1 AFTER 12 Noon.

Underpar is usually AFTER 11am on weekends

Yeah, I get it. It's a SHORT SEASON here, and Weekend mornings are PRIME TIME...when you see a 'deal' in that time-slot, you scratch your head and ask WHY!?

[chrish8]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

I love a deal as much as the next guy, but I'm wondering if we are dooming many of our courses with green fee deals.

I am on the fence on this.

1. I think it is a great way to make it affordable to get more people out golfing that normally would not spend the money for regular fees.

On the flip side I do think some of the companies out their are dangerous. Mostly a setup like Underpar which I am not a fan of at all. Their demands they set on the course is only to benefit themselves not the golfer and not the course. This is a big reason you see repeat courses put in more restrictions the 2nd time around.

I have talked with many who use underpar and look at that 1-3 day special offer for some really nice courses as the "new" rate to play that course anything higher is a rip off.

There are even posts here where some try to make the case; why pay to play a Copper Creek, Eagles Nest, Osprey etc.... when you can get 2-3 UP passes for a Maples of Ballentrae.....

And there are also those posts where people try to justify the already discounted UP price based on getting to do the replay

[AjaxGolf]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

It's funny but we thought exactly this today. We booked 10:48 at Glen Cedars and when we pulled in the parking lot was jammed. I was hoping there was a business meeting booked and not all golfers. We assumed we'd fly around on a Tuesday after Labour day but it turned out Tuesdays are play all day for $39.
The pro shop told me there were no worries about pace as they were coming in after 9 in 2 hours. Well it was a Sh1t show! 2.5 hours for the front and the back was much worse so we packed it in early.
The marshal said he works for a 4.5 hour pace. That's way too long for this course.
Bottom line? Yes they filled the tee sheet with bargain hunters but lost the business of people who were willing to pay a fair dollar for a reasonable pace. We should have gone down the road to Cherry Downs once we saw the parking lot. Live and learn.

Unless there is some deal I'm not aware of, isn't the rate on Tuesdays $49? Which is only $9 less than rack rate. And I don't think it's play all day.

[Left behind]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

Moat of the good deals to be had are on non busy times. Trying to fill those slots even at a discount its good business imo

This. When we start to regularly see deeply discounted prime time spots come up we're in trouble.

[synergy]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

If any business discounts their prices, that will always be the new price. And when golf courses (or any business) decide to compete on price alone, there's nothing left to set them apart from the competition.

The courses that use coupons fail because they don't follow through. They bring us in the door, but they make little attempt to up-sell. Come to think of it, most public courses are terrible at this. I've seen a couple of signs at the 9th tee for food, or an Ad that pops up on the GPS, but c'mon man, the best way to increase revenue is to sell to your existing customers – while they're at your place of business. The complacency of management in not coming up with ideas to increase sales is awful.

One idea I've often talked about is having a "Finisher" at the course. Much like a Starter, but more of an Ambassador that greets you as you come off the 18th green. Not hard to chat with the customers as they're adding up their scores, or even suggesting they stop in at the patio for a pint, or how about a simple "come back and play another round with us soon". Hand each player a $10 coupon? Saw this at Guelph Lakes, so not sure if that was an initiative by management or simply because the Starter shack is right in between the 1st teen and 18th green... or maybe the Starter was just a nice guy, who knows?

Absolutely mind boggling how courses are "phoning it in" when it comes to sales & marketing.

[Jeffc]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

If any business discounts their prices, that will always be the new price. And when golf courses (or any business) decide to compete on price alone, there's nothing left to set them apart from the competition.

The courses that use coupons fail because they don't follow through. They bring us in the door, but they make little attempt to up-sell. Come to think of it, most public courses are terrible at this. I've seen a couple of signs at the 9th tee for food, or an Ad that pops up on the GPS, but c'mon man, the best way to increase revenue is to sell to your existing customers – while they're at your place of business. The complacency of management in not coming up with ideas to increase sales is awful.

One idea I've often talked about is having a "Finisher" at the course. Much like a Starter, but more of an Ambassador that greets you as you come off the 18th green. Not hard to chat with the customers as they're adding up their scores, or even suggesting they stop in at the patio for a pint, or how about a simple "come back and play another round with us soon". Hand each player a $10 coupon? Saw this at Guelph Lakes, so not sure if that was an initiative by management or simply because the Starter shack is right in between the 1st teen and 18th green... or maybe the Starter was just a nice guy, who knows?

Absolutely mind boggling how courses are "phoning it in" when it comes to sales & marketing.

I like the "finisher" idea. All but a couple of course I play have abysmal customer service.

[golower]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

Stop discounting and start pricing accordingly to begin with. Reason most courses are discounting is because they are over rated and over priced in my opinion.

[quickgreens]

Re: Are discounted green fees killing our sport?

I guess it really is just a supply and demand situation. Golf courses aren't going to offer a discount if they are already filling their tee sheets. There are simply too many golf courses for the number of golfers. Survival of the fittest...nature's motto. I guess we will see who can survive and who will disappear.