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Way too early predictions for the 2022 Score Top 100 Movers

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  • midlifecrisis
    replied
    Originally posted by Joe Backyard View Post

    #18 at Burlington is a mediocre par 3 and has been for some time. Looking at their website, the club has redesigned the #17 hole (I believe this is the 3rd attempt to fix the hole). Trees on the right side along the lake have been cleared except for a couple of them. Green has been moved much closer to the lake and the pond which fronted the previous green remains as a hazard for leftward drives. Some sense finally came to the golf architect ... there's a lake there, use it.
    I could be mis-remembering -- haven't lived in Burlington for over 40 years -- but in the 1970s, wasn't the green on that hole in front of the pond? Feel like you can almost still see the outline of it on Google Maps. And that was the 18th, not the 17th. Though as I say, with the passage of time my memory may be playing tricks, too.

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  • JSGolf
    replied
    The course that get volleyed around is Lookout, I absolutely feel it should plummet like a rock. I mean unless the rating is solely based on being awkward and awful then it belongs in the top 10!

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  • Joe Backyard
    replied
    Originally posted by midlifecrisis View Post

    Burlington has been rerouted then. Back in the day the 18th was the narrow par 4 between the bay and the clubhouse. The hole I think you are referring to was 9 (IIRC - only played it a couple of times).
    #18 at Burlington is a mediocre par 3 and has been for some time. Looking at their website, the club has redesigned the #17 hole (I believe this is the 3rd attempt to fix the hole). Trees on the right side along the lake have been cleared except for a couple of them. Green has been moved much closer to the lake and the pond which fronted the previous green remains as a hazard for leftward drives. Some sense finally came to the golf architect ... there's a lake there, use it.

    Leave a comment:


  • midlifecrisis
    replied
    Originally posted by drewharvie View Post

    Pasatiempo ends on a brilliant par 3. Likewise for Kawartha and Burlington. It's a unique way to stand out.
    Burlington has been rerouted then. Back in the day the 18th was the narrow par 4 between the bay and the clubhouse. The hole I think you are referring to was 9 (IIRC - only played it a couple of times).

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  • Dougiefresh1991
    replied
    Originally posted by TheBananaSlice View Post

    I would watch full foursomes of dudes hitting drivers on 17 and wonder "why?" At least two of them would be out of the hole after one swing. It's just a five iron and a wedge. The driver seemed like a lot of risk for not much reward. The drainage is so poor that the course never plays bouncy enough to chase one up and I'm not long enough to carry the green on the fly. And if you do pipe it down the center, you're left with an awkward pitch.

    Seems easier, to my mind, to knock out a long iron or a hybrid and then hit it on the green with a short club. No real danger of the big number and still plenty of makeable birdie opportunities.
    Oh yeah that’s me! Haha but course
    management this year will be a new and improved player. For a while at least lol. But you’re right the drainage on a few holes is super bad but I like the course and the price especially

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  • drewharvie
    replied
    Originally posted by twooffthetee View Post

    Although I haven't played many (any?) courses with a par 3 finisher, I think it actually would be a good feature to have. Especially if you have walked the course and you are feeling pretty exhausted by that point, it would be nice to finish on a solid par 3.
    Pasatiempo ends on a brilliant par 3. Likewise for Kawartha and Burlington. It's a unique way to stand out.

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  • drewharvie
    replied
    Originally posted by Joe Backyard View Post

    I should've been more clearer ... its not ending with a par 3 on #18 but the combination of having a weak + short #17 that gives you the "is that it" feeling at the end. I did say #18 at Oshawa and Kawartha are fine holes. Anyhow, I believe on re-reading prior postings that the current #17 at Kawartha is staying but becomes #12 in the new layout.
    Fair enough. I have not played Oshawa, but 17 is not great at Kawartha on an otherwise spotless golf course.

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  • Joe Backyard
    replied
    Originally posted by drewharvie View Post

    A par 3, 18th is not a weakness, especially at Kawartha where it's a pretty good finishing hole. The 17th at Kawartha is the worst hole on the golf course. Sad to lose 16 as it's a cool hole.
    I should've been more clearer ... its not ending with a par 3 on #18 but the combination of having a weak + short #17 that gives you the "is that it" feeling at the end. I did say #18 at Oshawa and Kawartha are fine holes. Anyhow, I believe on re-reading prior postings that the current #17 at Kawartha is staying but becomes #12 in the new layout.

    Leave a comment:


  • midlifecrisis
    replied
    Brora GC in Scotland has a terrific par-3 18th and doesn't suffer at all for it. (It's uphill to the clubhouse that sits above the links and, as you say, you're kind of thankful for the short walk by that point) That's about the only one I can think of that I've been fortunate enough to play. Locally, Osprey Heathlands finished on a par-3 in one of its many iterations IIRC, but that was not the intended routing -- forced instead by the first clubhouse debacle I think. (On the other hand, I can think of numerous outstanding par-3 17th holes -- I guess that is S.O.P. in the architect's handbook).

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  • twooffthetee
    replied
    Originally posted by drewharvie View Post

    A par 3, 18th is not a weakness, especially at Kawartha where it's a pretty good finishing hole. The 17th at Kawartha is the worst hole on the golf course. Sad to lose 16 as it's a cool hole.
    Although I haven't played many (any?) courses with a par 3 finisher, I think it actually would be a good feature to have. Especially if you have walked the course and you are feeling pretty exhausted by that point, it would be nice to finish on a solid par 3.

    Leave a comment:


  • drewharvie
    replied
    Originally posted by Joe Backyard View Post

    Oshawa and Kawartha are strong layouts but they share the weakness of a flawed driveable par 4 as #17 and then ending on a par 3 on #18. The par 3's are fine holes but there's a sense of "is that it" which does bias one's reflection of the whole course at the end. Without knowing enough of the redesign in #15-16, it looks like the "architect" was limited in the vision or in the money available.
    A par 3, 18th is not a weakness, especially at Kawartha where it's a pretty good finishing hole. The 17th at Kawartha is the worst hole on the golf course. Sad to lose 16 as it's a cool hole.

    Leave a comment:


  • Joe Backyard
    replied
    Originally posted by TheBananaSlice View Post

    I would watch full foursomes of dudes hitting drivers on 17 and wonder "why?" At least two of them would be out of the hole after one swing. It's just a five iron and a wedge. The driver seemed like a lot of risk for not much reward. The drainage is so poor that the course never plays bouncy enough to chase one up and I'm not long enough to carry the green on the fly. And if you do pipe it down the center, you're left with an awkward pitch.

    Seems easier, to my mind, to knock out a long iron or a hybrid and then hit it on the green with a short club. No real danger of the big number and still plenty of makeable birdie opportunities.
    Oshawa and Kawartha are strong layouts but they share the weakness of a flawed driveable par 4 as #17 and then ending on a par 3 on #18. The par 3's are fine holes but there's a sense of "is that it" which does bias one's reflection of the whole course at the end. Without knowing enough of the redesign in #15-16, it looks like the "architect" was limited in the vision or in the money available.
    Last edited by Joe Backyard; Jan 20, 2022, 03:39 PM.

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  • TheBananaSlice
    replied
    Originally posted by Dougiefresh1991 View Post


    I mean you can hit drive on 16 and 14 and 17. I’m gonna miss 16 it was a tough golf hole especially the green being a mind f uck looks sloped front to back but it’s the other way. I am however looking forward to the new 17th for sure. Just not the walk from new 12 to 13 on the new routing don’t like the idea of walking up a full hole pretty much to the tee box just to go back down the same hole. But could be far worse. It’ll be a good summer none the less. If only I could figure out how to score properly on 7 and 11 after good drives.
    I would watch full foursomes of dudes hitting drivers on 17 and wonder "why?" At least two of them would be out of the hole after one swing. It's just a five iron and a wedge. The driver seemed like a lot of risk for not much reward. The drainage is so poor that the course never plays bouncy enough to chase one up and I'm not long enough to carry the green on the fly. And if you do pipe it down the center, you're left with an awkward pitch.

    Seems easier, to my mind, to knock out a long iron or a hybrid and then hit it on the green with a short club. No real danger of the big number and still plenty of makeable birdie opportunities.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dougiefresh1991
    replied
    Originally posted by TheBananaSlice View Post

    Only 15 and 16 will be removed. Honestly, I've always thought they were two of the weaker holes so they won't be missed (by me). The flow of the finish will likely be improved. I always found it strange that the last driver was hole 13. I like a few good driver tests down the finishing stretch. With the new tees on the current 14th (16 in the new routing) and the new par 5 (17th), there will now be several (optional) drivers in the closing stretch.

    I mean you can hit drive on 16 and 14 and 17. I’m gonna miss 16 it was a tough golf hole especially the green being a mind f uck looks sloped front to back but it’s the other way. I am however looking forward to the new 17th for sure. Just not the walk from new 12 to 13 on the new routing don’t like the idea of walking up a full hole pretty much to the tee box just to go back down the same hole. But could be far worse. It’ll be a good summer none the less. If only I could figure out how to score properly on 7 and 11 after good drives.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheBananaSlice
    replied
    Originally posted by Joe Backyard View Post

    I understand the holes #15-16-17 were to be altered. #16 is 3rd best hole in the back 9 and sorry to see it go. The other 2 were a bit pedestrian so layout can only improve.
    Only 15 and 16 will be removed. Honestly, I've always thought they were two of the weaker holes so they won't be missed (by me). The flow of the finish will likely be improved. I always found it strange that the last driver was hole 13. I like a few good driver tests down the finishing stretch. With the new tees on the current 14th (16 in the new routing) and the new par 5 (17th), there will now be several (optional) drivers in the closing stretch.

    Leave a comment:

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