Welcome!

Welcome to our community forums, full of great people, ideas and excitement. Please register if you would like to take part.

This is extra text with a test link..

Register Now

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Golfword article " The Flaw in the New World Handicap System "

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #61
    Originally posted by dmcdam View Post

    My adjusted score
    I understand what you meant.
    however what you have used/interchanges net score and adjusted score and they are not the same.

    you are referring to is your ESC adjusted score.

    lets say your course handicap is 9 and you shoot a gross score of 85,
    your net score is 85 - 9 = 76

    your ESC adjusted score ( in the current system) for a 9 hc would be your gross score less any strokes above net double bogey ( double is most a 9 hc can take in the current system)
    so if you shot the same gross 85 and made nothing worse than double you would have an ESC adjusted score of 85. If you had 2 triples it would be 85 - 2 = 83 and so on.
    Last edited by Weirfan; Jan 6, 2020, 11:06 PM.
    "Don't cry because it's over, Smile because it happened "

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Ignatius Reilly View Post

      If you are entering your adjusted score, why is everyone telling each other what their net/adjusted scores are? Who cares what the other guys adjusted score is? Or are you checking that they're not cheating/sandbagging when they enter their scores?

      I pay the most attention to my actual score or my match status. Adjusted score? Enter hole-by-hole and let the computer figure that out.

      I've played with some guys who pick up and just enter their ESC scores on holes if they've hit the ESC limit, but I have no idea why.
      We keep one scorecard with gross scores. When we're counting up after 18, we adjust the scores so everyone can enter an adjusted 18 hole score whenever they get a chance. It's usually a deduction of 1 or 2 strokes at most for each player.
      We may not be good but at least we'll be slow - PB


      TM RBZ Tour 10.5 set to 9 deg with Aldila RIP Alpha 70s
      Adams IDEA Super Hybrid XTD 17 deg stiff
      Nike Machspeed 3H 21 deg stiff
      Wilson FG Tour V4 - 4i-GW - DG Pro S300 - TLT build
      Cleveland/TM wedges - 53 / 56 / 60 - all one length
      Cleveland BRZ Classic 1 putter
      Srixon Star XV
      Ogio Grom bag

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Weirfan View Post

        I understand what you meant.
        however what you have used/interchanges net score and adjusted score and they are not the same.

        you are referring to is your ESC adjusted score.

        lets say your course handicap is 9 and you shoot a gross score of 85,
        your net score is 85 - 9 = 76

        your ESC adjusted score ( in the current system) for a 9 hc would be your gross score less any strokes above net double bogey ( double is most a 9 hc can take in the current system)
        so if you shot the same gross 85 and made nothing worse than double you would have an ESC adjusted score of 85. If you had 2 triples it would be 85 - 2 = 83 and so on.
        Yes - this
        We may not be good but at least we'll be slow - PB


        TM RBZ Tour 10.5 set to 9 deg with Aldila RIP Alpha 70s
        Adams IDEA Super Hybrid XTD 17 deg stiff
        Nike Machspeed 3H 21 deg stiff
        Wilson FG Tour V4 - 4i-GW - DG Pro S300 - TLT build
        Cleveland/TM wedges - 53 / 56 / 60 - all one length
        Cleveland BRZ Classic 1 putter
        Srixon Star XV
        Ogio Grom bag

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by Ignatius Reilly View Post

          If you are entering your adjusted score, why is everyone telling each other what their net/adjusted scores are? Who cares what the other guys adjusted score is? Or are you checking that they're not cheating/sandbagging when they enter their scores?

          I pay the most attention to my actual score or my match status. Adjusted score? Enter hole-by-hole and let the computer figure that out.

          I've played with some guys who pick up and just enter their ESC scores on holes if they've hit the ESC limit, but I have no idea why.
          I see this too. I am certainly not an expert, but many of the people in the group I play with - very likable all, have very little appreciation for the finer points of handicap indexes and adjusted golf scores. But none play in serious competitions or even carry an official index, and their lack of insight on calculation scoring for handicap purposes probably has a beneficial effect on their enjoyment of the game.

          They seem to operate on a vague understanding of something called "equability", which for anyone in non competitive play, prescribes the maximum score that is to be entered on the card for any hole - on any course. So, great if you screw up really badly on a par 5, but horrible if you crap out on a par 3. So many are close to breaking 90 - but are they really?

          A senior men's league I played in actually had written rules about the proper measurement of gimmies, requiring all lost balls be treated as they would be in a lateral hazard (old rules) and set out an Equitable Stroke Score table, leaving the impression that the maximum score set out under the Course Handicap rating, was the number of strokes to be entered on the score card. Some took this as gospel and entered their sores accordingly.

          The golf course actually produced individual handicaps for all of the players in the league based on these "rules".

          Why does this happen? Players who are too lazy or disinterested to bother to learn about these things, or conventions that are difficult to absorb and confusing and off-putting to a majority?



          Fortunately there are no rules limiting the number of golf balls you can carry during a match!

          Comment


          • #65
            Originally posted by Ignatius Reilly View Post

            If you are entering your adjusted score, why is everyone telling each other what their net/adjusted scores are? Who cares what the other guys adjusted score is? Or are you checking that they're not cheating/sandbagging when they enter their scores?

            I pay the most attention to my actual score or my match status. Adjusted score? Enter hole-by-hole and let the computer figure that out.

            I've played with some guys who pick up and just enter their ESC scores on holes if they've hit the ESC limit, but I have no idea why.
            That is exactly what happens in the groups that I play in, and I do it also. If my score cannot contribute to the betterment of the team's score and I've reached my ESC, I've usually lost interest in that hole and have nothing more to gain or lose, and don't want to delay proceedings by making a two foot putt for an eleven. (and the rest of my group would be on the next tee while I was putting that two footer)

            Comment


            • #66
              ^^^^ This.

              Your handicap is your handicap at the start of the round. Strokes and stroke holes are based on that and not very difficult to mark on the card if you wish to do that.

              Your score is the total of all your strokes, including any penalty strokes. There is no upper limit to that number, as I have proven time and time again.

              What you enter into a handicapping system is usually a different and slightly smaller number. But it is not your score.

              Match play sure makes it easy.
              P1: "What are you"?
              P2: "I'm an 18 here, what are you?"
              P1: "I'm a 12 here, so you get 6 strokes"
              Both: "okay, I'll put a mark on (handicap) holes 1 thru 6 to remind me".

              Timer, in the background: "Gentlemen, that took 20 seconds."
              "Confusion" will be my epitaph
              ...Iggy

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Ignatius Reilly View Post
                ^^^^ This.

                Your handicap is your handicap at the start of the round. Strokes and stroke holes are based on that and not very difficult to mark on the card if you wish to do that.

                Your score is the total of all your strokes, including any penalty strokes. There is no upper limit to that number, as I have proven time and time again.

                What you enter into a handicapping system is usually a different and slightly smaller number. But it is not your score.

                Match play sure makes it easy.
                P1: "What are you"?
                P2: "I'm an 18 here, what are you?"
                P1: "I'm a 12 here, so you get 6 strokes"
                Both: "okay, I'll put a mark on (handicap) holes 1 thru 6 to remind me".

                Timer, in the background: "Gentlemen, that took 20 seconds."
                I have a few buddies , both low single digit handicaps , who will pick up reaching max ESC. I've never asked why but assume it is a combination of frustration and not being able to enter a score higher than the ESC. Both play competitions so of course don't then. Its not to speed up play as they are not slow and almost always shoot scores in the 70's.

                perhaps it's the same rationale as why some people who pick up after double par? That isn't the correct way to keep score either but in those cases when somebody has taken 10 strokes, it probably helps pop.

                I play out the hole in the majority of instances ( match play would be the exception) and do so even if i'm putting for a 10 .....and Idid that a few times last year . I often play at off times as a single or twosome in well under 3 hours so never worried about pace. In a GTA am event last year I took a 10 on a par 4 and completed the hole before the other two guys who made birdie and par....

                In the very rare instance that I am really out of it and holding the others in a friendly, then ...I will pick up and write down my most likely score...not the ESC.
                "Don't cry because it's over, Smile because it happened "

                Comment


                • #68
                  When they brought slope indexes into the calculations a few years back here, everyone panicked. Every course you showed up to had a chart posted, generally on the local rules board that showed what your playing handicap was for each set of tees on offer. I believe it was issued by Golf Aus, so they all looked the same. The same thing should hopefully happen in Canada. No calcs needed.

                  As for individual hole scoring and shot allocation, this confused me for a couple holes and then it was second nature. A lot of the competition golf here is stableford, so you need to do this for the competition to work. After one round, you'll be an expert. Play off 15? Get shots on all but 16-18 capped holes. Very simple. Run out of shots, pick up your ball and move on, unless you are playing socially, then you do what you want. It's great for pace of play as well.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by johnny canuck View Post
                    When they brought slope indexes into the calculations a few years back here, everyone panicked. Every course you showed up to had a chart posted, generally on the local rules board that showed what your playing handicap was for each set of tees on offer. I believe it was issued by Golf Aus, so they all looked the same. The same thing should hopefully happen in Canada. No calcs needed.

                    As for individual hole scoring and shot allocation, this confused me for a couple holes and then it was second nature. A lot of the competition golf here is stableford, so you need to do this for the competition to work. After one round, you'll be an expert. Play off 15? Get shots on all but 16-18 capped holes. Very simple. Run out of shots, pick up your ball and move on, unless you are playing socially, then you do what you want. It's great for pace of play as well.
                    The same charts have been available in Canada for several years; handicap by tees also available on the Golf Canada score centre.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Originally posted by rulie View Post

                      The same charts have been available in Canada for several years; handicap by tees also available on the Golf Canada score centre.
                      So it's very simple really.

                      Working out your playing cap is very simple as well at the moment. Handicap multiplied by slope, divided by 113.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by johnny canuck View Post

                        So it's very simple really.

                        Working out your playing cap is very simple as well at the moment. Handicap multiplied by slope, divided by 113.
                        Is Australia going for
                        Course Handicap = Index x (Slope/113) .... (as in UK)
                        or
                        Course Handicap = Index x (Slope/113) + (Course Rating - Par) ..... (as in USA and Europe)
                        Putting isn't golf, greens should be treated almost the same as water hazards: you land on them, then add two strokes to your score.
                        - Chi Chi Rodriguez

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by aaagc View Post

                          Is Australia going for
                          Course Handicap = Index x (Slope/113) .... (as in UK)
                          or
                          Course Handicap = Index x (Slope/113) + (Course Rating - Par) ..... (as in USA and Europe)
                          We are going to have the second option in Aus. Won't make any difference for me, as my home track rates either 71.9 or 72.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            It seems that England is the only place where (CR - Par) is not being used. I am still trying to get a sensible justification from them.
                            Putting isn't golf, greens should be treated almost the same as water hazards: you land on them, then add two strokes to your score.
                            - Chi Chi Rodriguez

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              With respect to entering scores for match play: You are out of the hole but within 5 feet of the pin. Add 1 stroke. More than that, 2 strokes. Move on to the next hole. Add em up later

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                We us the same format for our Stableford competitions (btw most of our weekly events are Stableford out here). You have reached a point where you cannot add any points, within 5 feet of the hole, pick it up and add 1 stroke. In the rough beside the green, pick it up and add 2 strokes. Use Max score if necessary but no more than that.

                                Comment


                                Join The TGN Email List

                                Collapse

                                Recently Joined

                                Collapse

                                Topics: 174,256   Posts: 1,824,040   Members: 47,224   Active Members: 204
                                Welcome to our newest member, Lefty66.

                                Today's Birthdays

                                Collapse

                                PGA Leaderboard

                                Collapse


                                TGN Sponsors

                                Working...
                                X