Pace of Play? (tournament)

[cuonthe1t]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

talk about slow play Phil is not on the 8th green yet and he has been out for 2 hours and 16 minutes in the 4th round of the Northern Trust Open

[rulie]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

talk about slow play Phil is not on the 8th green yet and he has been out for 2 hours and 16 minutes in the 4th round of the Northern Trust Open

However, Phil's group was waiting on the tenth tee for the group ahead to clear the green? What is it you want to suggest?

[cuonthe1t]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

That the pace on the PGA Tour is becoming a problem --just as it is for us at our courses--- a five to five and a half hour round is one of the main reasons golf is losing players/popularity

[rulie]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

That the pace on the PGA Tour is becoming a problem --just as it is for us at our courses--- a five to five and a half hour round is one of the main reasons golf is losing players/popularity

I certainly agree that the length of the rounds is having an impact on the number of rounds played - just can't afford that much time.
However, just because the PGA Tour players take that long (remember, the tour is also considered "entertainment"), doesn't mean that every other player has to emulate them in that regard. We shouldn't blame them for our own slow play.

[Playthru]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

It's one thing to deny the clubs that don't pay their dues, the benefits of membership. It's quite another to deny them to individuals who are more than willing to pay their dues to join the association. The policy is clearly directed at discouraging those who would like to play in tournaments from joining clubs who are not members of the GAO. From my perspective, this policy is wrong-headed.

While I agree it appears wrong-headed, I would like to know about the financing before judging the policy.
What would happen, for example, if most golf courses opted out of the GAO, but individuals were allowed to pay their dues and play in GAO events. Would the GAO still be around? I don't know for sure but I suspect that the individual member dues alone cannot fund the GAO. Again, I stand to be corrected by those more knowledgeable about the workings of the GAO.

[mpare]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

You have a point. However, I doubt very much that the majority of clubs would abandon the GAO. As it now stands, individuals who are not members of any club can become members of the GAO and play in their tournaments. However, if an individual were to join a non-member club, then the player loses his right to play in their tournaments. The problem with the GAO's present approach is that it fails to distinguish between the clubs who choose (sometimes for financial reasons) not to join the GAO, and their individual members. In the end, they effectively drive away the very people that they should be working hard to attract. Which begs the question, why should any such person support the GAO by becoming a dues paying member?

While I agree it appears wrong-headed, I would like to know about the financing before judging the policy.
What would happen, for example, if most golf courses opted out of the GAO, but individuals were allowed to pay their dues and play in GAO events. Would the GAO still be around? I don't know for sure but I suspect that the individual member dues alone cannot fund the GAO. Again, I stand to be corrected by those more knowledgeable about the workings of the GAO.

[JGT4]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

While I agree it appears wrong-headed, I would like to know about the financing before judging the policy.
What would happen, for example, if most golf courses opted out of the GAO, but individuals were allowed to pay their dues and play in GAO events. Would the GAO still be around? I don't know for sure but I suspect that the individual member dues alone cannot fund the GAO. Again, I stand to be corrected by those more knowledgeable about the workings of the GAO.

There are two issues to be considered here.

Membership in a provincial association is also membership in the national organization. Their respective programs are interwoven at both the funding and the delivery level. To change the membership model requires the agreement of ten provinces and Golf Canada.

The membership model in use for many years is one in use in many countries around the world and it is based on the club-member paying the dues via the golf club. So the golf clubs include the membership fee in their annual dues billing to the members. Some clubs identify it on the invoice, some don't. The GAO invoices the clubs based on the reported membership count the previous year. So when we get into statements that such and such club decided not to be a member of the GAO, this is club ownership deciding the issue unilaterally on behalf of their members and prospective members. That is a large part of the problems.

[Playthru]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

You have a point. However, I doubt very much that the majority of clubs would abandon the GAO. As it now stands, individuals who are not members of any club can become members of the GAO and play in their tournaments. However, if an individual were to join a non-member club, then the player loses his right to play in their tournaments. The problem with the GAO's present approach is that it fails to distinguish between the clubs who choose (sometimes for financial reasons) not to join the GAO, and their individual members. In the end, they effectively drive away the very people that they should be working hard to attract. Which begs the question, why should any such person support the GAO by becoming a dues paying member?

I will only make one other point for your consideration. Some of the clubs that are not members of GAO are able to offer very reasonable membership fees - maybe yours is one of those. One of the ways they are able to do this is by foregoing GAO membership - ie cutting costs. Members who join those clubs are effectively taking advantage of those cost savings, a saving not afforded to members of GAO member clubs.

[Playthru]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

There are two issues to be considered here.

Membership in a provincial association is also membership in the national organization. Their respective programs are interwoven at both the funding and the delivery level. To change the membership model requires the agreement of ten provinces and Golf Canada.

The membership model in use for many years is one in use in many countries around the world and it is based on the club-member paying the dues via the golf club. So the golf clubs include the membership fee in their annual dues billing to the members. Some clubs identify it on the invoice, some don't. The GAO invoices the clubs based on the reported membership count the previous year. So when we get into statements that such and such club decided not to be a member of the GAO, this is club ownership deciding the issue unilaterally on behalf of their members and prospective members. That is a large part of the problems.

I posted my response before seeing yours. Question: How are dues figured out for true public courses with no membership option available? And how are dues figured out for semi private courses - where there are some members but also open to the publc?

My apologies to the OP for serious thread jacking.

[JGT4]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

I posted my response before seeing yours. Question: How are dues figured out for true public courses with no membership option available? And how are dues figured out for semi private courses - where there are some members but also open to the publc?

My apologies to the OP for serious thread jacking.

OK. I am moving this discussion to a more appropriate forum, The 19th Hole under the title "Public Player Programme" .

[A Man Called Papa]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

OK. I am moving this discussion to a more appropriate forum, The 19th Hole under the title "Public Player Programme" .

Thanks JGT4, that's where it belongs over on the 19th Hole. Now let's see if we can resist commenting any further on this forum if someone elects to carry on here.

[Taewoo87]

Re: Pace of Play? (tournament)

Pga seems not really caring about them?