What a shame. As a life long Leaf fan, I'm watching the game right now and I'm rooting like hell for Carolina. The only way for this mess to end is for the Leafs to hit rock bottom and they are very close. They say that's the only way junkies and drunks finally turn it around and the Leafs brass has to stand up and say "My name is Toronto and I'm a lousy organization".
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
The reality is, it's the life long leaf fans that have driven the team to this state. Say all you want about Maurice and JFJ but if the fans keep on coming and watching on TV, why would the Teacher's Pension board invest a cent more into this team. Just ask Scotty Bowman. The Leafs may be next to last when it comes to winning games but if you stacked up all the teams and measured them on financial indicators (valuation, revenue, profitability, liquidity, etc..) they would be head and shoulders above the rest of the league. Just read Fortune a few months ago.
What the team really needs is new ownership. Imagine how fun it would be if they had an owner like Mark Cuban. As much as he likes to make money, he has an equal passion for building a tremendous team that wins championships year after year. In my opinion, as long as the team generates double digit returns for the Pension board year after year, nothing will really change. -
Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
Hey MP33... how much more money do you think the owner of the ML can spend. They have already spend the max.
You can say that Maurice sucks or that JFJ is useless but saying that a different owner would spend more money is IMPOSSIBLE.
As far as Mark Cuban goes, he is flashy but if you watch the NBA could you please tell me the last time Dallas (or Mark Cuban) won a Championship...
At the end of the day you could change the owner, coach, manager, the players still don't play that hard. I laugh early in the year when Tucker said that he loves playing against the Sens because he always play harder.... really ... shouldn't every player play hard every game.
If the fans could just accept the fact that they will finish last this year and stop complaining maybe the ML could draft Svatos next year. What about Tavares in 2 years.
They have to do like the Raptors and trade a Jalen Rose for basically nothing. With a cap that is the way to go. Get rid of McCabe or Kubina or both for a third round draft choice. Not much in return but their contract of the book.
Maybe JFJ should talk to Colangelo and ask him how to deal with the salary cap.
Last year the Raptors won about every trophy they could get on the management side. Coach of the Year and Administrator of the year. The funny thing they have the same owner and the same upper management as the Leafs...If you think it's hard to meet new people, try picking up the wrong golf ball.Comment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
The game just ended and you would think they just won the Stanley CUp. Way to go Leafs you won and are in 14th place. My heart won't stop racing I am so excited.WHAT SITS ON MY CLIC-GEAR
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
When knucklehead Kabina iced the puck and gave Carolina a face off in the Leaf end with 2.5 seconds to go I was hoping for another collapse.Originally posted by hogannutComment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
Not impossible. $$ doesn't always have to be spent on players. Management have a role to play as well. Why else would you bring in an unproven, no name GM to manage this team. It's obviously not because they couldn't afford a more prominent guy. Sure it's a tough job working for the Leafs, but, if you threw enough money at someone prominent (Brian Burke type) they will come. Look at the Scotty Bowman situation from the summer. Tannenbaum wanted it to happen. Discussions were going well. Scotty asks for Brian Colangelo level money (minus JFJ salary as he wouldn't take on the GM role as well like Colangelo) and then three members of the pension board veto him coming on board. Scotty has openly talked about this on the Fan, Hockey night in Canada and the Globe has even wrote about this same story. LIke I said, why spend when you don't have to.Originally posted by Chambokl
As far as Cuban goes, my point was more directed at his passion for the team and winning. You can tell the guy loves the team, is a fan and wants nothing more but for them to win. If only the owners of the leafs had the same passion. As Dalton McGinty stated today, "if the leaf mgmt only put as much energy in building a winning team as they do in making $$, a lot of people in Ontario would be a lot happier".
The Leafs and Raptors may have the same upper management but the teams are not treated the same. The Raptors do not have a following like the Leafs and their management realize this. This is why they started from scratch and went out to get Colanagelo, who was at the time NBA exec of the year, to rebuild a winning team. In doing that, they paid him big bucks and gave him full control on what to do with the team. On the Leaf side, they gave an unproven GM the job, definately are not paying him what Colagnelo is getting and according to the recent press, only a fraction of the authority a normal NHL GM would have. Same management but very different treatment.Last edited by MP33; Jan 15, 2008, 09:40 PM.Comment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
You are right about Cuban. I think like you, that it is awesome to have an owner who has so much passion. I don't know how much the GM and coach enjoy this but...
The Teacher's Pension Plan has assetts of $106 billion. I don't think that the profit the MLSE make every year is a big deal. All they care is what the value of the franchise (Raptors and ML) will be when they sell it. For this I am sure they would love the 2 franchises to do well as their value will be a lot more. Last year the return on investment was 17% and it didn't come from the profit from MLSE.
I totally agree with you that JFJ might not be the best GM. If the best GM they can find today is Cliff Fletcher they have a problem. The best thing would be to find a young GM that understand how to manage a team under the cap. Look at the Rangers this year, they spend lots of $$ this summer and everybody was ready to give them the Cup. As of tonight they are 5 points ahead of the Leafs.
Coming back to Cliff Fletcher, he was in Phoenix from 2001 to 2007. He was let go after Phoenix had they worst campaign since leaving Winnipeg. I couldn't stop laughing when most of the Toronto media was ready to name Fletcher to replace JFJ. Not sure if a GM from the 90's could do the job today.
MP33, if you were name GM tomorrow what would you try to do? I have no idea where I would start. Like I said I would probably try to get rid of some of the big contract. Tucker, Kubina and McCabe for sure and I don't have to get much in return. Would try to trade Sundin for hopefully a young player and maybe a 1st round draft choice and a 2 more lower one. Maybe get rid of Raycroft for a 2nd or 3rd round pick. Again, I would try to unload contract. I would sit on this for a couple of months and see where the team is going. Hopefully get a good young (Svatos) player in the draft and leave him in Jr next year. Another hard year next year with all the whinning about losing but go for a chance to get Tavares (2009) while the young players are developping.
I don't think there is an easy way to improve the Leafs...If you think it's hard to meet new people, try picking up the wrong golf ball.Comment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
What a bunch of no-talent warriors last night.
With their back against the wall and with the us-against-the-world attitude, they squeezed out a win against the Stanley Cup champion.
JFJ did a great job managing by not doing or saying anything to distract the on ice focus before the game.
McCabe was brilliantly hurt and hidden so that the chance of him coughing up puck was neutralized.
Just so that the fans get their money's worth, they let Carolina closed the gap. After all, the longer the fans stay on the seat, the more $15-beer they would buy.
Did anyone catch how precisely Toskala kicked the puck back to the Carolina player who graciously repaid the generosity by scoring after given a second chance?
All in all, the warriors showed up last night.
Next, someone needs to break the news to them that there's 82 games in a season, and that there's 60 minutes in a game.Comment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
That's inaccurate, there is no salary cap on the coach, GM, scouts and the amount of money you spend to scout out players, to find the "diamonds in the rough" like Detroit has been able to do.Originally posted by ChamboklR15 BLACK 9.5
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
I think people who think Sundin will be traded haven't been listening to him in the interviews. I too was roped into the rumours last week that Mats might be willing to wave his no trade, but IMO he's not. Sudin is simply not interested enough in a Stanley cup to move. We here in Canada struggle with that thinking, as the cup is the holy grail of hockey but in Europe World Cups and Olympics are more important, and SUndin has done well at the international level. ANyway the rebuilding process would have to be done WITHOUT trading Sundin.
Having said that and knowing the almost endless supply of $ MLSE has what I would do is buy out Mc Cabe, Tucker, Kubina, Raycroft, Blake as my first order of business. Then I would call Sundin into my office to find out how many more years he will comit to, so I would know how long I had to find a new captain, because NO ONE in that room right now could be a captain.
From that point, as per Damien Cox yesterday I would implement a new policy for the entire organization that unless you have won a cup or another award that MLSE does not sign players to longer than 3 years, and that MLSE no longer signs no-trade, no movement clauses. Then if you've got someone who's earning big $ and they are not performing you can send them to the minors if you need to.
I would also implement a policy that no 1st round draft could be traded in the first 3 years of signing them (Cox's article). Very sound thinking.
If these things happened it is possible within 3 years the team would be a playoff team, and within 5 years a cup contender, provided you did everything right and didn't deviate from the plan.WHAT SITS ON MY CLIC-GEAR
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" The secret is in the dirt "....... Ben HoganComment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
As far as JF Jr is concerned I think he should go. That being said he should not have to see who is being interviewed as his replacement in the media on a daily basis. That is classless from the powers above. The best thing for the Leafs is to be sold to an owner who wants to win like Ottawa. Then clean house from top to bottom.In the Bag:
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
You are correct in saying that there is no easy way. I've never been the GM of a sports franchise but if it were me taking over, I would take the first 30 - 60 days to assess the competence of the support staff which makes up "upper management". I am not talking Tannenbaum and Peddie but people (who would report into the GM) like the head of amateur scouting, pro scouting, etc. to better understand how they go about their business on a day-to-day basis. After that assessment, I would clean house. Get rid of the incompetence and bring in a supporting team that I have confidence in. Once this team is assembled, I would build a short and long term plan for the team. The short term would address the tactical things you mention (what to do with McCabe, do you trade Kaberle). The plan would also articulate a vision of where the team (realistically) aspires to be in 2 - 3 years time. The long term plan would build on the short term plan and would no doubt have a Vision which includes winning the cup. This would probably be a 5+ year time horizon and would include tactics like establishing greater scouting presence in Europe or the NCAA,etc...Originally posted by Chambokl
Sounds like a job interview but IMHO, there is no short fix and the only way to get out of this hole is to bring in good people, build a realistic plan that everyone buys into and then execute. Not unlike any other business in dire need of a rehaul.Comment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
Originally posted by MP33
Why not save some time and just clean house on day 1
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
AM 640 Toronto Breaking News...
The Leafs have recieved permission from the Coyotes to talk to Cliff Fletcher about filling in as interim GM, according to the Canadian Press. Fletcher is still under contract with PhoenixComment
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Re: Toronto Maple Leafs
Dammit, I KNEW there was a reason why my wife has been spending all our money on gadets, gizmos and doo-dads for the house.Originally posted by Chambokl
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